The United States Mint has made a further modification to the Circulating $1 Coin Direct Ship Program. As of November 15, the Mint will impose an order fulfillment charge of $12.50 for each box of coins ordered through the program.
The Direct Ship Program was introduced in June 2008 as a means to proactively comply with the requirement of Public Law 109-145 to remove barriers and improve circulation of the $1 coin. Individuals or businesses were able to order quantities of $250 worth of $1 coins directly from the Mint at face value. Typically, the coins are distributed by the Federal Reserve Banks in $1,000 boxes or $2,000 bags. In theory, the direct distribution in smaller quantities would allow the $1 coins to be more easily introduced into circulation.
Abuses of the program were widely reported in late 2009. Some individuals used to program to earn miles or rewards on their credit cards. Massive quantities of coins were ordered at face value with a credit card. Upon receipt the coins were immediately deposited at a bank. The net result was zero cost with the benefit of the accrued credit card rewards. In the most extreme case, a Wall Street Journal article mentioned one person who claimed to have bought $800,000 in coins through the program.
Since this time, the US Mint has struggled to curb the abuses to the program. Initially, the Mint was reported to have tracked down and cut off some of the biggest abusers. In early newspaper coverage, Mint representatives made statements indicating that coins ordered through the program would be treated as cash advances, although this turned out to be false. Later, the Mint imposed specific ordering limits and required customers to agree to comply with the intended purpose of the program. In July, the Mint stopped accepting credit card orders through the program and required payment by check, money order, or bank wire.
The US Mint offered this explanation for the new $12.50 fee for each box ordered through the program: “This new charge is a result of our continual effort to review programs to ensure that they meet our commitment to prudent fiscal management on behalf of the American public.”
The decision to start imposing a fee now seems completely ridiculous.
According to data included in a report issued by the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System, the United States Mint distributed 244 million $1 coins through the Direct Ship Program through June 1, 2011. This means that the US Mint absorbed the costs of credit card fees, order fulfillment, and shipping for nearly one million $250 boxes of coins, during a period of widespread abuse.
After the recent requirement for payment by check, money order or wire was imposed, surely anyone using the program just to earn credit card rewards would have stopped. So now that all of the abusers of the program are finally gone, the US Mint will impose fees on the remaining legitimate users? And this is supposed to remove barriers and improve circulation of $1 coins? Clearly, the original concept of the Direct Ship Program has gone completely out the window.
And you still can’t order with credit card? I would consider ordering with the fee if I could use credit card again, but this new fee with no other changes is a double whammy which will deal the death blow to this program.
I don’t get it.
Believe it or not, this is a step the Mint took to end the direct shipping program altogether. In the next disclosure report, they will claim, no one is using the program, so it has to be terminated.
And by further inference, we can see the Mint is seeking to end the $1 president program by blocking its circulation. I feel sorry for all the money wasted in the entire fiasco, but also kind of relieved that the pain does not have to drag on for another decade.
If they wanted to end the program, they would have done so. The Mint had ample justification from the highly publicized abuses and there is no specific requirement to distribute directly to the public.
I have not seen any evidence of the Mint trying to end the program. They have tried to get Congress to modify the program to make it more viable, suggesting the removal of the production requirements for the N.A. dollars and removal of the introductory window for the Presidential Dollars.
The first coin for William McKinley scheduled in 2013 can be a good stop point so that the series can be called US president $1 (Part 1: before 20th century) and leave the Part 2 for the future. Hopefully they will come up with a better release plan and better designs next time.
I have purchased a box of $250 about once every 2 months since the program started. I am not one of the abusers. I love coins and I am an outspoken proponent of the dollar coin over the dollar bill, for a myriad of reasons. All my friends, and many of the merchants I patronize, know me as the guy who uses $1 coins for all his small purchases. I reluctantly made the transition to paying via personal check for my last 2 orders. But I have to say, this latest change will end my advocacy of the $1 coin program. If the US Mint wanted to drive a knife through the heart of the few legitimate cheerleaders for the $1 coin out here in the “real world” they couldn’t have done a better job than this. No more dollar coins for me. I’ll go back to using the worthless paper, even though I despise them.
Michael,
If the Mint does not want to end the program, another reason might be they want to absorb some operational losses. Did they stock up too much silver/gold/platinum at their peak prices?
Wow. Can you stop making weird comments completely ungrounded in reality? The US Mint is hedged on their precious metals.
The Mint is run by the govt. Do you really expect anything better from the govt? Do you really? If so, why? With very rare exception, they continually screw things up. This is who they are. Its what they do. They will not fix the problems except by dumb luck and then another drone will come along and “fix” it some more.
I read recently that the Mint has awarded a six year contract to a British firm to “fix” their online presence and ordering system. Does it make sense to hire a British firm to do this for the United States Mint?
Its called Standard Operating Procedure.
I_S
I they would just stop making the dollar note, none of this would be an issue.
It’s beautiful in it’s simplicity, isn’t it?
This is NUT…..Mint try to get money from us as soon as they find a new way
I have been buying the dollar rolls from the Direct Ship program since it started. I keep one roll for my collection and I spend the rest. Some restaurants know me as the one who always pays with dollar coins. It is rather fun.
Since they switched to paying with a check, I haven’t needed to buy any. I’m not really interested in getting money for more than face value (paying for the cost of a check and a stamp constitutes more than face value) but I was considering continuing since I like to keep one roll for myself.
Now I’m done. When my supply runs out, I will be like most of the rest of the population and refuse to use them. Thanks a lot, US Mint!
Well at least I got my 5 25th anniversary sets which I plan to hang on to forever (or until I absolutely need the money) and the process took me only 10 minutes…
This means that the US Mint absorbed the costs of credit card fees, order fulfillment, and shipping for nearly one million $250 boxes of coins
This may be technically true, but each $1 coin only costs 0.32 to produce. So even if each $250 box cost the mint $25 in credit card fees and shipping, the mint still made a tidy $145 in profit per box.
The real problem with the program has nothing to do with abusers. The real problem is that it does absolutely nothing to actually circulate the coins. Say you walk into a Starbucks and pay for your coffee with a pair of shiny $1 coins. What are the odds that the wage slave at the register will even consider using it to make change for the next customer? Right about 0%. So they go to the bank as part of the nightly deposit and the bank ships it back to the Fed and then it goes to the vault and stays there. As long as the Fed continues to print $1 notes, $1 coins will remain a non-starter. Get rid of the notes and the coins will begin circulating without any program from the mint. That’s what happened in England.
Unfortunately, this isn’t likely to happen anytime soon. The imbeciles that we send to congress are always at the ready to waste taxpayer’s money by meddling with the mint. I guess BEP suppliers have more political clout than the mint suppliers.
For those that want to use $1 coins now, you don’t actually need any mint program either. Your local bank will gladly order as many coins as you want, so long as you don’t insist on a specific year. And they will only charge you face value of the coins.
Sorry…the Mint doesn’t get $145 in profit per box. If that was the case, the Mint would also get about $1 in profit for every dollar they printed. We all know who gets the profit. It’s called the Federal Reserve (not the Mint). The Fed determines how much is printed of what denomination. The US Mint just follows orders.
Ah… I’m thinking any bags in the warehouse will be sitting a long time. Nobody’s going to get these with a fee. If they want to circulate dollar coins they need to get rid of the $1 bill. Simple solution, of course it won’t happen, since it makes sense.
So now you have to pay to buy from the mint. Yet, you can go to ANY bank and order a box of $1 coins for FREE. Or just ASK them for their $1 coins. Most banks HATE the $1 coins, and will give you AS MANY AS YOU WANT for absolutely FREE.
I pick up Half Dollars often. Use them and give them in change. Just to brand myself and have customers remember me. Almost EVERY time i go into a bank I ask if they have any loose halves. I even rotate branches just to hit as many as possible to get more halves. They invariably reply “No (Or maybe they have a few) but we have a lot of the DOLLAR coins. Would you like any of THEM? PLEASE take the dollar coins!!”. So screw the mint. get your dollar coins from the banks for FREE instead of PAYING the mint to send them out.
Just FYI if you still like getting dollar coins …
there goes that- ….”and so it goes” – Kurt Vonnegut
As I said in the other thread, I cannot imagine what the Mint is thinking. Maybe they are getting orders from above to make “X” number in profit, and are casting about for ways to quickly make money? Their entire strategy towards sales of clad products just seems to become more and more bizarre every day.
Not for flippers. Where can I get the newest mint stats again? My grubby hands are watching the 50gold burnished eagles very, very, very……..very closely. The only native dollar I want is the MS 68+ peace pipe. Cause Er…. Um…. I like peace;)
Nevermind. Found stats on numismaster.
08 is 11,908 and 11 so far is 7674. Gettin close I tell ya. And it is HARD to find a well priced MS 68 peace dollar!
I actually lost miles when using the DS program. Yes, I would get 250 miles when I purchased the coins but then I would not get any when making cash purchases. So if I bought something for $12, I would use a $10 note and two dollar coins. The $10 bill gets no miles (the two coins already earned theirs).
I didn’t mind not getting the extra miles because the coins are fun to use but after the mint stopped taking CC I stopped buying DS coins.
I have ordered numerous boxes of the $1 coin direct ship products based on which rolls I was able to get or not get from my local bank. I usually keep one roll or two and have spent the rest as part of my normal spending. The need to write a check in this day of electronic payments is one I was willing to forgo to get rolls of the $1 coins I have been unable to acquire from my local bank but the addition of this $12.50 charge is a real show stopper. The Mint could not do more to kill a program if they tried. I can’t imagine this is their ultimate goal considering there has been no legislation to decrease production so this means even more coins will end up in Federal Reserve vaults now. You really have to wonder about the Mint leadership, or lack thereof.
If that was the case, the Mint would also get about $1 in profit for every dollar they printed
On what planet? The last time the mint printed a dollar bill is never. All dollar bills today are printed by Bureau of Engraving and Printing on behalf of Federal Reserve. Not coincidentally the dollar bills are called Federal Reserve Notes.
The US Mint most certainly does earn a profit. Because the profit is the result of government manufacturing money, it is called seigniorage. This is the difference between face value of the coins and the cost of manufacturing them and running the mint. This profit (seigniorage) is transferred to the Treasury (not the Fed). In 2010 this amount was $388,000,000.00
Almost EVERY time i go into a bank I ask if they have any loose halves. I even rotate branches just to hit as many as possible to get more halves.
If you want halves, just ask to speak to the branch manager and ask him to to order you a box or more. $500 in each box. Any commercial bank can do it. Also free. I’ve done it many times. One time last year I even found 2 1964 silver halves in one roll.
This is par-for-the-course for the Federal government. The left hand has no idea the right one exists.
I lost my allegiance for the Mint with their total clusterf**k that was their 25 anniversary American Eagle silver set. After finally getting through five or so hours after they went on sale, I was told that since they were all sold out, I would be put on a waiting-list. Shortly after, I received an email explaining that
I would not be receiving a set.
Irritated by their incompetence, I wrote the Mint, telling them that I would no longer be ordering any more items from them, and to delete my personal info.
The Mint simply has no idea on how to deal with the public. And I for one refuse to conduct business with an organization like this.
Shutter: Lucky guy! I’ve been thru many bags of halves and have not found one silver one. + the looks I get from younger folks who’ve never seen them.
Joe: read up on who gets the seigniorage from the different types of money, you are mistaken. The Fed pays the mint dollar for dollar for coin, they pay the bureau of engraving and printing a few cents for every note produced. US Coin is really the only “lawful money” left albeit tokens
For dollar coins its easy..go to the ATM take out whatever, walk into the branch and ask for dollar coins. Its not difficult.
Now’s truly time to say goodbye to buying dollar coins directly from the USM. I used to buy small quantities of Native American coins online by credit card and have been debating if I should go to the trouble of sending in snailmail to get them. Now the USM has finally managed to help me make the decision. Oh, also, please get rid of the Presidents dollar coins — they’re just too ugly in comparison with the Native Americans.
I have always thought it strange that the Mint never had recent dollar rolls available for the Direct Ship Program. For a long time, the only ones were from the first few years. (Did they ever have any from 2009 on, even Lincoln?) Now, there is only one president available, and that is James Madison from 2007.
If they really wanted to get the public to order these dollars to circulate them, then you would think the Mint would offer every president as soon as they were released … especially when they say there is a glut of them around.
The bulk of the dollar coins presumably go to fulfill the Federal Reserve orders. I wonder if the Mint saw the profitability of the “P” and “D” Presidential Rolls, which are currently sold at 60% over face value, and diverted the remainder of the dollar coins to the numismatic rolls program, leaving little to none of the coins for the Direct Ship Program.
The Mint had already made a commitment to the Direct Ship Program, but only continued it half-heartedly, and now they don’t seem to care if it succeeds or not with the imposition of a service fee. (Imagine … charging us for the privilege of doing them a favor!)
Remember, the US Government gets the profit from selling COINS,
the Fed Res, and it’s private bank owners get the profit from selling PAPER Dollars.
Now, wonder why coins are being sabotaged?
Never was in the DS program but used to get the silver proof sets which started including the presidential dollars. Got a few of those and got tired of seeing a “silver” proof set containing pot metal dollar coins. No more silver proof sets for me. Now the native American dollars have some outstanding designs but as they are also produced in potmetal I am taking a pass on them too. I think a “real” silver presidential and native American dollar proof set would do well.
Why mint why? You hear stories of all these overflow dollar coins — make them available already.
I think the Mint is allowing this program to whither away because it has not been sucessful in its mission. They no longer see the need to pay the freight on an item that the banks/Fed will soon be paying. They know that robust distribution is right around the corner with the elimination of the paper dollar.
With very hard fiscal choices coming soon, this has become an easy one.
If the US Mint wants me to use and circulate these Chuck E. Cheese tokens, they would have to pay me $12.50 per box!
My 25th anniversary sets arrived yesterday. I was number 38377xxx. I hope another anniversary set is put out next year because these are so nice.
That wouldn’t be much of an anniverary set. Probably a 30th would be next.
I just discovered this program early this month and placed an order before 11/15 using a check because I appreciated the face value price with no shipping charges. I will not be using the program again since I can go to the bank and get them at face value without the $12.95 fee.
The problem with the DSP and any of the Mint’s numismatic offerings is that they could care less about the end users of the product. They are only interested in making physical coinage, and the amount of seignoirage generated from such coinage. Let’s not forget that any coin inscribed with United States of America passes through the Mint and they have a total monopoly on this process. Distribution channels are secondary afterthoughts. That is why there was a maximum five sets per order on the recent 25th ASE set fiasco. Here is where the real problem lies: greedy speculators looking to make a quick profit, driving up the secondary prices of the sets to multiples of the MSRP, and then when the next “hot” low mintage thing comes along, the pricing gradually comes back down to earth, as most speculators jump onto the next bandwagon. 2010 America the Beautiful 5oz bullion, anyone?
Sometimes the greed of some “collectors” makes me wonder if they even care about their karma at all. For the record, I stayed away from the MInt on 10-27. It was a train wreck that could be from weeks before.
I’m done with the President Dollar carnival coins. What a waste of time and money. The sac dollars may have stood half a chance in circulation if the doofs that decide these things would have made the Presidential coins on commerative silver dollars or half dollars. It could have been such a great silver program.
Michael – Just wondering if there is any news on the Mint offering an un-circulated dollar set with the 2011-W ASE (burnished)?
“Sometimes the greed of some “collectors” makes me wonder if they even care about their karma at all. For the record, I stayed away from the MInt on 10-27. It was a train wreck that could be from weeks before.”
Are we supposed to be impressed with that? Sounds like some sour grapes to me. The market is what it is. Many collectors on this blog bought sets to have as collectors and sold a few to pay for the rest of them or to purchase something else for their collections. You missed out on a beautiful set of coins that is a classic rarity. Hopefully I got your sets while you have your ethics still intact.
Wow, just got a 1939 Mercury dime in change from Starbucks in Chagrin Falls, OH! Made my day.
I just discovered the program in early November and ordered 2 boxes using a personal check and the mail-in order form. What I don’t like about that process is I can’t find my order online in my account and I’m unable to track it. It has been at least 2 weeks, maybe 3 since I mailed my check and I have not received anything yet, not even an email confirmation of receipt.
Now I will never use the program with the NEW FEE.
Here’s a suggestion to the Fed. Res.:
You’re at the ATM machine and wish to withdraw $20 or more :
BELLS AND WHISTLES GO OFF AS IF YOU HIT THE ONE ARM BANDIT JACKPOT AND $1 COINS COME FLYING OUT OF THE MACHINE.
Now you need that money purse around your waist and get exercise carrying it around.
With the advent of coinless and paperless money right around the corner (I give it another decade) thanks to super duper computer processing technology to handle transactions with your phone representing your identity and banking why even spend money minting at all except for collectors.
FYI NO MORE PAPER BONDS as of Jan.01, 2012 …must go to http://www.treasurydirect.gov to buy securities on auction, T-bills, EE, I bond or Zero C of I.
When the new U.S. Mint site is introduced in the fall of 2012 will there be a fee to access the site, perhaps a quarter or two ???? (Someone has to pay for the upgrade). It will be similar to using an ATM which is not your bank’s; do you accept the fee ?
When at the casinos, if you feel the need to drop a deuce you need quarters, don’t you or are they dollars now to use the commode? And don’t forget to tip the guy that patrols the restroom on your way out !
The reason dollar coins aren’t popular is because they are too big and heavy, if they were the size of a nickle there would be something to talk about.
As I said on the other thread, this is truly putting a stake right through the heart of every remaining die hard collector who was doing their part to circulate the presidential coins.
I have been getting 4-5 rolls since Washington and have been doing my part to distribute them.
There is no way that a program that is desperate to circulate as much as this one should be charging the last remaining holdouts to do their work for them.
If I continue getting them it will be through the bank and not through the DS program.
Not much change for me. The only ones I had to get through the Direct ship program were the American Indian dollar rolls as the local banks never carry them. I guess I am done with the American indian rolls or I can look to ebay and get one off there I guess. Stupid idea by the mint though.
Obviously everyone’s efforts to help the mint circulate the coins did not amount too much, and it was riddled with “unethical” buyers. These coins are rarer than the the ATB quarters to find in circulation. This is like a TV program with a cult following, but no ratings. If your part of the cult then your very upset when the show gets cancelled, but nobody else has even heard of the show, much less watched it. As I stated in an earlier post the US Government has been trying to get a dollar coin to circulate since 1878, and all these dollars ever do is collect dust in a warehouse. Could someone please explain to me why are people so shocked that the mint is curtailing the program? Why is is a stupid idea for the mint to stop a program that is obviously not working?
i was paying $35.95 for 1 roll of the p or d presidential rolls from the mint. $12.50 for 10 rolls is a bargain now that the p and d rolls are $39.95. right? i gave up on the presidential dollars last year. still trying to get rid of them. they do make great tooth fairy money. have not decided wether i am going to continue purchasing the p and d native american dollars. i am still a sucker for the Presidential $1 Coin Uncirculated Sets. i just hope they do not go up any more. $20 for $8 makes me crazy.
The numismatic rolls and the Direct Ship rolls only differ in the coin wrapper. The former says “P” or “D” to denote the striking mint, and the latter does not indicate the mint. The coins themselves are exactly the same as the circulation ones that are shipped out to the Federal Reserve and into public hands.
For some people, the roll wrapper is enough to justify paying almost 60% over face value for the numismatic rolls. Time will tell if people are just as willing to pay 5% over face value ($12.50 for a $250 box) for a non-mintmarked wrapper. As Jason said, 5% over face is a better deal than nearly 60% over face … if a mint-specific wrapper is not important to you.
As for myself, I think I will continue to buy the Native American dollars. Unlike the Presidents dollars, these coins have very attractive designs and tell stories about the heritage and culture of the Indian people. They are considered to be part of the Sacagawea series, so there is a collector base for them; or one can collect them as a separate or subset series.
But I will wait a while before I mail off my check for the Native American dollar coins in the Direct Ship Program. The Mint may hear the outcry about the unreasonable (and perplexing) service fee for the program, and take a second look at it. One can only hope that the Mint will see its folly and decide not to implement the fee.
Sorry to switch topics, but it looks promising that we will get a price drop on gold coins tomorrow. I only hope it holds for next week when Lucretia Garfield goes on sale. A one-tier drop saves me $75, since I buy one proof and two unc of each new issue.
I’m getting dizzy watching the silver price the past couple of days. Talk about violent swings!
Yeah, I think the extra charge for the direct ship program stinks as well… If the mint really wants to get folks using coinage for daily commerce, they need to rethink this move…What really needs to happen for the public to embrace coinage rather than paper money is we need to have not only $1 coins, but $5, $10, $20, etc…. People don’t want to carry the $1 coins around because to get 20 dollars worth of them, you get a fair amount of weight… Seems like a simple option to come up with some larger denomination coinage and start phasing out paper money at the same time.
On a different note: The Glazier 5oz ATB coin (NP7) shows now as “sold out” on the US Mint website. That can’t be right… I think they meant NP5! In any case, this series is pretty much dead with the increase in mintage from 2010 to 2011. Does anyone know anything about the 2012 series and their mintage?
…likewise, the 2011 American Eagle Silver Proof Coin (PS4) shows as “sold out” now!
I am working on confirming this info. right now, it looks like the 2011 Proof Silver Eagle really might be sold out. The Glacier 5 oz. probably not.
I’m glad I got my Proof ASE coin as part of the 25th Anniversary Set. I didn’t see that one selling out until some time next year. I wonder if the Uncirculated version will be very far behind?
It does seem extremely unlikely that the sellout of the 5 oz. Glacier coin is real. While it’s quite possible that the Mint has not struck 35,000 of them and the initial supply is exhausted, they can strike more within the 35,000 limit for a little over 5 more weeks yet in 2011 if they want to. It would make sense to do so, since they can continue to be sold next year. Why not generate additional revenue?
The 2011 burnished silver dollar may just be a sleeper. If I remember correctly before the 25th anniv. sets came out sales were around 200K, add another 100K for the sets and that may still be below the 2006 or any other burnished eagle to date. We will wait for the mint sales report. Please correct me if I’m wrong.
Just wondering if weekly sales report is out yet? – Thanks
Just published a few minutes ago
http://news.coinupdate.com/us-mint-sales-proof-silver-eagle-sold-out-1070/
I’m bummed about the new charge as well. Since I work for a living, I rarely find time to get to a bank when it’s open, so I was using the program on a regular basis to get those coins in circulation. It was fun using them. Guess I’ll be going back to paper now. Sigh.