America the Beautiful–Ozark National Scenic Riverways quarters officially launched


Alley Spring Mill. (Photo by Jimmy Emerson, DVM)

Today marked the Mint’s official launch of the Ozark National Scenic Riverways quarter dollars. The event kicked off with the 11 a.m. launch ceremony at Alley Spring and Mill in the park followed by the noon release of the bags and rolls of Uncirculated coins on the Mint’s website.

One of the area’s most popular photo sites—and the subject of the 38th design in the America the Beautiful quarter series—Alley Mill sits on the Jacks Fork River near Eminence, Missouri. The building, which contains a steel roller mill for grinding wheat into flour, was erected in 1894. According to Aaron J. McKeon (America’s Beautiful National Parks),

Ozark National Scenic Riverways, formed by the Current and Jack Fork Rivers, was the first national park founded to protect a wild river system. The rivers are fed by more than 300 springs, including the largest concentration of first-magnitude springs in the world. A first-magnitude spring has a flow of at least 65 million gallons of water per day. The aptly named Big Spring has a daily water flow of 286 million gallons! The springs, especially Blue Spring, are a particularly beautiful shade of blue.

Blue Spring. (National Park Service photo)

Blue Spring. (National Park Service photo)

Each reverse depicts a view of Alley Mill in the middle distance, situated on the Jacks Fork River, which flows from the mill toward the viewer. Trees frame the scene at left and right, with a suggestion of forest in the deep background behind the mill. A wide, plain rim holds the incused legends OZARK RIVERWAYS (at top), MISSOURI (at lower left), and E PLURIBUS UNUM (at lower right). The date is placed on the rim at the bottom of the design.


Clad quarters are composed of outer layers of copper-nickel (.750 copper, .250 nickel) bonded to an inner core of pure copper, for a total composition of 8.33% nickel, 91.67% copper. Each weighs 5.670 grams and measures 24.26 mm in diameter. The edges are reeded. The products available from noon today are as follows:

100-coin bag (P) $34.95 17ABG
100-coin bag (D) $34.95 17ABH
100-coin bag (S) $34.95 17ABJ
2-roll set (P,D) $32.95 17ARG
40-coin roll (S) $18.95 17ARH
3-roll set (P,D,S) $46.95 17ARJ

The three-coin set (17AF), which contains Uncirculated quarters from the Philadelphia and Denver mints and a Proof quarter from the San Francisco Mint, will be available at noon on June 26. The 5-ounce silver Uncirculated version of the coin should follow shortly thereafter.

Click here for more images of Alley Spring and Mill.   ❑

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  1. Sith says

    These quarters are easy to find in circulation now. I’m surprised anyone would pay a premium for the coins, except for the “S” rolls. They should be able to go to the bank and get them at face value.

  2. KML in KY says

    Pre ordered my 5 ouncers from APMEX. Looks like the best design this year.

  3. cagcrisp says

    As the dollar index Continues to Fall, Gold Continues to Rise.

    The dollar index has Lost 3.5% YTD

    The USD has Lost 6.4% vs. the All important EURO in that same time frame…

  4. says

    PRECIOUS-Gold hits near seven-week high as dollar, stocks slip

    * Dollar hits seven-month low against basket of currencies
    * Palladium hits fresh high since Sept. 2014
    * Silver marks highest since April 25

    (Updates prices, adds quote)
    By Vijaykumar Vedala
    BENGALURU, June 6 Gold touched its highest in
    near seven weeks on Tuesday as Asian stock markets and the
    dollar weakened ahead of a UK national election and a European
    Central Bank meeting due later this week.
    James Comey, former head of the U.S. Federal Bureau of
    Investigation, is due to appear before a Senate committee for
    the first time on Thursday. Comey was fired by President Donald
    Trump in May while leading a probe into alleged Russian meddling
    in last year’s U.S. election.
    The events all have the potential to boost the safe-haven
    appeal of bullion, which is often used as an investment option
    during times of political and financial uncertainty.
    “Much will, of course, depend on the U.S. dollar. However,
    with event risk in the form of this Thursday’s ECB rate decision
    and the UK general election, one would expect the safe haven bid
    to be alive and well as the week progresses,” said Jeffrey
    Halley, a senior market analyst at OANDA.
    Spot gold rose 0.8 percent to $1,289.20 per ounce, as
    of 0805 GMT. Earlier in the session, it hit a peak of $1,289.67
    an ounce, its highest level since April 19.
    U.S. gold futures climbed 0.7 percent to $1,291.8 an
    “Generally light positioning and numerous upcoming
    geopolitical events should continue to underpin demand for the
    metal, with targets extending to the 2017 high around $1,295 and
    the psychological level of $1,300 above this,” Sam Laughlin,
    senior precious metals trader at MKS, said in a note.
    In Britain, Prime Minister Theresa May’s lead over the
    opposition Labour Party has narrowed to just 1 percentage point,
    according to a poll by Survation for ITV television on Monday.
    The vote is now expected to be much tighter than previously
    “A decent win for the incumbent should ease any geopolitical
    fears. A hung parliament or a move towards the Labour Party
    could lead to some uncertainty fuelling gold prices,” said
    National Australia Bank analyst John Sharma.
    Meanwhile, ECB policymakers are set to take a more benign
    view of the economy when they meet on Thursday and will even
    discuss dropping some of their pledges to ramp up stimulus if
    needed, four sources with direct knowledge of the discussions
    told Reuters last week.
    In the wider markets, MSCI’s broadest index of Asia-Pacific
    shares outside Japan fell 0.3 percent, while the
    dollar index touched a seven-month low against a basket of major
    Among other precious metals, palladium marked its
    strongest since Sept. 11, 2014, at $850 an ounce, and silver
    hit a high of $17.682 an ounce, its highest since April
    Platinum gained as much as 0.8 pct at $958.05.

    (Reporting by Vijaykumar Vedala in BENGALURU, with additional
    reporting by Koustav Samanta; Editing by Tom Hogue and Sherry

    All aboard the PM roller coaster.., tickets selling out fast..,

    Just add a little sugar and spice from North Korea and we gonna have grand time!

  5. says

    The U.S. Mint perfected another noteworthy ‘ swing and a missed’ on another great opportunity to field a unique and innovative design when the Treasurer and Committees passed on the Ozark design of the action scene with the river cooter in the forefront and on coming canoe’ers in the backdrop.

    There’s a reason why this series equates to arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

    Glad I loaded up on P and BU Roosevelt’s, and then pulled the plug.

  6. jp says

    @Louis, in reply to your response about the William Henry Harrison dollar rolls sellout, “Yes, I know, but so did other rolls. Not a big deal. Just wondering if there was more to it.” My recollection is that the William Henry Harrison rolls sold out relatively quickly. Curious what other presidential dollar rolls sold out, or how to find sell out data like this. Maybe you ask because that data does not inform how quickly they sold out after date of issue(?).

    btw, this coin featured in the article appears as one of the nicer looking quarters designs for this year. It reminds me of the detail and design of the smoky mountain quarter, which I like.

  7. So Krates says

    @Sith – Yes, Freddie supposedly sold out about two weeks ago. Apmex is buying them at spot +$2/oz and selling at $128.

  8. Sith says

    @So Krates – Thank you for the confirmation. At a 20K mintage I may pick up an extra

  9. data dave says

    So the Effigy puck passed the Ft. Moultrie puck. Bullion sales seem to be on a rebound. As cagcrisp mentioned the dollar has weakened which helps PMs.

    Can anyone point me to the lowest Ozark puck price (with capsule included)?

  10. cagcrisp says

    @data dave, “So the Effigy puck passed the Ft. Moultrie puck. ”


    Fort Moultrie is 34,700…

  11. Larry says

    Regarding the “quasi” mint marked ASE’s, on HSN the other night I bet about 75% of the show were these coins. He had complete sets of 2016 “PSW” in MS69 or 70. same with 2017. I have a feeling there are going to be a lot of disappointed folks when they try to sell these. It’s hard to believe even HSN sells them in light of the mints recent announcements about them.

  12. cagcrisp says

    @data dave, “Bullion sales seem to be on a rebound”

    I’m not seeing that.

    Total sales YTD for the 2017 bullion pucks are 65,400. In 2016 Shawnee by itself sold 105,000 and Total sales for the 2016 bullion pucks are 295,600.

    I don’t see 2017 getting Anywhere near that number…

  13. cagcrisp says

    16AN 2016 ATB SILVER UNC 5 OZ – FT MLTR 17,163 + 32
    17AJ 2017 ATB SILVER UNC 5 OZ – EFF MNDS 15,146 + 56
    17AK 2017 ATB SILVER UNC 5 OZ – DOUGLASS 13,929 (979)

  14. cagcrisp says

    16XA 2016 WALKING LIBERTY 24K GOLD .5OZ 63,547 +44
    16XC 2016 STANDING LIBERTY 24K GOLD .25OZ 89,987 + 58

  15. cagcrisp says

    16EA 2016 AM EAGLE SILVER PROOF 1 OZ 559,745 + 1,515

    16EB 2016 AM EAGLE GOLD PROOF 1 OZ 23,620 + 5
    16EC 2016 AM EAGLE GOLD PROOF 1/2 OZ 5,706 +1
    16EF 2016 AM EAGLE GOLD PROOF 4-COIN SET 17,269 +7

    16EG 2016 AM EAGLE SILVER UNC 1 OZ 198,665 + 1,617

  16. cagcrisp says

    17EA 2017 AM EAGLE SILVER PROOF 1 OZ 265,963 + 2,824

    17EB 2017 AM EAGLE GOLD PROOF 1 OZ 5,155 + 89
    17EC 2017 AM EAGLE GOLD PROOF 1/2 OZ 1,120 +83
    17ED 2017 AM EAGLE GOLD PROOF 1/4 OZ 1,732 +45
    17EE 2017 AM EAGLE GOLD PROOF 1/10 OZ 7,573 +195
    17EF 2017 AM EAGLE GOLD PROOF 4-COIN SET 6,932 + 72

    17EL 2017 AM BUFFALO GOLD PROOF 1 OZ 9,622 +395

  17. cagcrisp says

    Wow…Unc Gold is in the same stratosphere as the FS coins…

    17CA 2017 BOYS TOWN GOLD PROOF 1,330 + 21
    17CB 2017 BOYS TOWN GOLD UNC 1,746 + 3
    17CC 2017 BOYS TOWN SILVER PROOF 19,766 + 153
    17CD 2017 BOYS TOWN SILVER UNC 9,056 +31
    17CE 2017 BOYS TOWN CLAD PROOF 15,158 +68
    17CF 2017 BOYS TOWN CLAD UNC 13,629 + 37
    17CG 2017 BOYS TOWN 3-COIN SET 4,785 +20

    17CH 2017 LIONS CLUBS SILVER PROOF 60,768 +1,193
    17CJ 2017 LIONS CLUBS SILVER UNC 15,812 + 63

  18. cagcrisp says

    JQ1 2015 FS GOLD PROOF 1/2 OZ – TRUMAN 2,675 + 1
    JQ2 2015 FS GOLD UNC 1/2 OZ – TRUMAN 1,874 –
    JQ4 2015 FS GOLD UNC 1/2 OZ – EISENHWR 2,014 + 2
    JQ6 2015 FS GOLD UNC 1/2 OZ – KENNEDY 6,692 +10
    JQ8 2015 FS GOLD UNC 1/2 OZ – JOHNSON 1,790 +2

    16SA 2016 FS GOLD PROOF 1/2 OZ – NIXON 2,541 + 2
    16SB 2016 FS GOLD UNC 1/2 OZ – NIXON 1,625 –
    16SC 2016 FS GOLD PROOF 1/2 OZ – FORD 2,350 +3
    16SD 2016 FS GOLD UNC 1/2 OZ – FORD 1,610 +1
    16SE 2016 FS GOLD PROOF 1/2 OZ – REAGAN 3,504 + 5
    16SF 2016 FS GOLD UNC 1/2 OZ – REAGAN 1,882 + 6

  19. cagcrisp says

    The mint WILL pull the Gold Standing Liberty quarter and the Gold Walking Liberty half at some point BEFORE the announced mintages are met.


    Even the mint will be embarrassed to leave the coins for sale for that long a period of time.

    Using the past 5 weeks sales average and using the stated mintage it will take an Additional 100 weeks to SO the half and an Additional 125 weeks to SO the quarter.

    (…AND…that’s making an assumption that sales will be as strong going forward as they currently are)

    These are Two Gold coins that Should have SO on Launch Day…

  20. earthling says

    Those “Tribute” Gold Coins seem to be generating as much excitement as a generic bullion round. Or the Gold Kennedy.

    With the continuing decline in mintage year after year , when will it all finally just totally go poof? The Pogues pulled out of the ultra rare market. The rest of the world continues to pull out of the modern fluffy market.

    What was the end like for the Franklin Mint? I dropped out of Coins during that decline so I didn’t get to witness that end.

  21. earthling says

    How long has the South Korean Chiwoo Cheonwang been around? Sounds better than the upcoming Silver Liberty. I might have to get a few.

  22. KEITHSTER says

    See the #’s for the Douglas quarters are out at 185.8 & 184.8 will try the bank for some more in the morning. Hope they have some left they have been harder to get then the Mounds can still get all of those I want but have too many now?? So that leaves 94.2 mil. of the Ozarks made sofar but will bet they make more than the last two as it is a looker”>”>”> Well Good Luck All”<"<"<

  23. Erik H says

    earthling, I just discoverd the Chiwoo Cheonwang medals thanks to an e-blast from MCM. Looks like last year was the first year of the series. Unfortunately for MCM their prices are too high on just about everything, so like the US mint I just have to say no! I picked up my Chiwoo Cheonwang off the bay and saved big time.

  24. says

    APE is Up

    99.95% platinum
    Item Number: 17EJ
    Mintage Limit: 10,000
    Product Limit: 10,000
    Household Order Limit: 1

  25. Buzz Killington says

    Anybody tempted by the “flavor of the month” silver rounds would do well to check the current prices on the once-scorching “Zombucks” series. I personally liked the Zombuck series, but now that the series is over, the premiums have dropped like a rock.

    Five years down the road, I think any of these series will be readily available.

    I find it interesting that the mort art-y Momento Mori series from one of these private mints supports its pricing by jacking up the prices for older issues. But those too, will eventually be liquidated and floating around.

    The only silver round I almost never see is the new silver Britannias with the privy rim. They have to be somewhere, though.

  26. Sith says

    @Buzz Killington – FYI Britannias are not rounds. They are manufactured by the British Royal Mint

  27. sharks2th says

    I don’t see the APE selling out quickly this year. Last year there was a rush because no one knew if the Mint would have the entire 10k available following the low mintage of 2015. Since they sold most of the 10k last year I do not think there will be rush on opening day this year. Most of the flippers got burned last year with the 10k mintage. This year should be more of a normal “collectors and dealers” type of sales year for the APE. Based on today’s trading numbers it would open at $1,300.00.

    The reuse of the 1997 design is a bit boring, but it fills in for a year so the Mint can get another series going. I do like the shorter series they have been running with the Platinum Proofs. People can do short sets of select series if they do not want to collect all of the Platinum Proofs. Others have commented on how long some of the series have been (quarters, first spouses, presidential dollars, etc.) and I agree some of the series are a bit long. The 3 to 6+/- year series are a good time range to run.

  28. John Q. Coinage says

    Sith we rarely see any new ATB’s here in Los Angeles, they are almost impossible to get @ banks, maybe @ a market or such you can pick up a roll if you’re lucky, on the other hand, besides for coin junkies no one cares, I have so many rolls of state 25c’s sitting around……

  29. Sith says

    @John Q. Coinage – Sorry to hear about that, here on the east coast they are all over the place. In fact, I just got a Freddie yesterday. Saying that just two years back they were scarcer than hen’s teeth.

  30. Sith says

    The 2016 Silver Proof Set is listed as sold out. If so we have a new set low of about 370K

  31. Hidalgo says

    The 2016 Limited Edition Silver Proof Set, which contains the silver dime, quarters, and half dollar sold over 40,000 units. There was no 2015 Limited Silver Proof Set. That should make the 2015 silver dime and half dollars more rare than their 2016 counterparts.

  32. Sith says

    @Hidalgo – All true, but as previous discussed, for some reason people find value in “rare” labels, and OGP.

  33. joe#2 says

    Sith? Just curious, Why do you find OGP NOT the way to go? If it’s straight from the Mints, You know it’s real. What’s the difference between a 69 or 70 grade??? I have seen better 69’s. I think people are just brainwashed into spending silly money for a sticker… The only thing with OGP’s, They take up space.

  34. Asherspapa says

    Is that really all for July? APE and Ozark puck? Or do we think more July items will be posted later?

  35. Asherspapa says

    Also, anyone know why no edge lettering on ASL medal, as there is on the AGL?

  36. Sith says

    @joe#2 – Sorry I was not clear. I love OGP, but I find it funny, when people purchase things based on the packaging, not the coins. The Limited Edition Silver Proof Set is a prime example. It sells for $139. If you bought the Silver Proof Set, and the ASE individually, it would cost you $102. I.E. people pay $37 more, for the limited edition packaging, with the irony that they also get less coins. All I’m saying is certain people will pay extra for the 2016 Silver Proof Set because the coins are wrapped in a “rare”package, and ignore the fact that the 2015 Silver Proof Set actually has the “rare” coins.

  37. joe#2 says

    Sith? ok. I understand. Agree 100% with you. Thanks for the clarification. 🙂

  38. cagcrisp says

    Oh Lord, Oh Lord, Oh Lord…


    For a MEDAL…

    Oh Lord, Oh Lord, Oh Lord…

    The Mint REALLY REALLY REALLY is needing revenue…

    …AND…That’s all they have.

    “Each medal is hand packaged in an exquisite, black matte finish presentation case and is accompanied by a companion booklet detailing the evolution of our Nation’s symbol.”

    Wow…$20 for packaging…

  39. cagcrisp says


    #1 . Either the Mint is mistake about what the market will bear
    #2. OR…I’m mistaken about what the market will bear

  40. cagcrisp says

    @KCSO, I guess since it’s a Medal, that’s why we didn’t HAVE to see a notice in the Federal Register…

  41. Asherspapa says

    2016 ASL = $34.95 mintage 12.5K each mint
    2017 ASL = $59.95 mintage unlimited
    If there was any doubt about intelligent life in the U.S. Mint, this categorically proves there is none! That suggests the four-medal set later will be in excess of $200!! Robbers and idiots.
    I wanted those medals but waiting until the secondary market price plummets make more sense now. I wonder if they’ll even sell the 25k the 16 version did?

  42. says

    I guess so,

    I’m still shell shocked, I’d wouldn’t have been surprised with a $10, but $20???


    In a year or two, this is a $29 easy find

  43. says

    LOL, that’s funny Asherspapa

    & good point, yeah, that 4 banger is easily upwards to $200 now

    I can’t WAIT to see that 🎁!

    Bet it’s a $40 📦

  44. Tom P. - MA says

    $59.95 with a mintage of 75,000 and no household limit, maybe. I would have considered up to $40 in the real world. I’m out.

  45. Erik H says

    I was waiting for the Liberty medal price to see if would be better to order my silver proof sets next week and combind shipping. At $59.95, I will pass and just order my silver proof sets tonight. Thank you US mint for saving me money once again this year.

    Still MIGHT buy a reverse proof medal off the secondary market after they come out. After Ozark 5 oz. comes out I won’t have anything too buy. What a crappy 225th Anniversary!

  46. earthling says

    Don’t worry none about them ASL Silver ding-a-ling Medals. I’ll pass the word along to the Granny Knittin Club Investment Circle that they can bypass Jethro from the Shoppin Channel . All of them together will buy out those Medsls in about 3 days, direct from the Mint. If they was young hens I’d say they would be doin a buyout in 4 minutes , but you know how some of the elders move so slow.


  47. Buzz Killington says

    Interesting dichotomy on the medals. High price and Unlimited mintage both act to discourage flipping.

    But flippers are the Mint’s most reliable customers.

    I would love to see this situation create a genuine rarity that will hold its value, but I’m not going to gamble that it will.

    (@Sith — To me, all of these silver pieces, whether with a monetary value are not, are “silver rounds”, even though I understand that is not technically true. There seem to be a lot of rounds that attach themselves to a government (Somalia, Equatorial Guinea, Armenia) that is really just a license at best to tack onto a silver round to make it a “coin”, but I see that as a thin veneer.) And the RCM, Perth Mint, and now the BRM are no better.)

  48. sharks2th says

    The medal ripoff prices will be slightly less than the commemorative ripoff prices. The commemorative silver proofs are $68.46 per ounce because the commems only have 0.77 ounce of silver (@$52.95 for the proofs). These would be best purchased a few years down the road at melt prices if you collect medals.

  49. Mint News Blog says

    Gents, where are you finding the $59.95 price for the medal? I’m looking at the website and it’s still showing me “N/A.” I’ve emptied my cache but I’m still getting the same result.

  50. Keep Calm & Stack On! says

    It was in an email sent via the US Mint,

    Send your email to me and I’ll forward it, or post it here –

  51. says

    U.S. Mint: News Release
    United States Mint Releases Silver Medal Commemorating Its 225th Anniversary on June 14

    WASHINGTON – The United States Mint (Mint) will make available for purchase the American Liberty 225th Anniversary Silver Medal™ (product code 17XB) on June 14 at noon Eastern Time (ET).

    The Mint is issuing this one-ounce proof medal in celebration of its 225th anniversary this year. Struck in 99.9 percent silver at the Philadelphia Mint, it is the medallic counterpart to the gold coin released earlier this year featuring a modern rendition of Liberty.

    The obverse (heads) depicts a profile of Liberty wearing a crown of stars with the inscriptions “LIBERTY,” “1792,” and “2017.” The reverse (tails) depicts a bold and powerful eagle in flight, with eyes toward opportunity and a determination to attain it, with the inscription “UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.”

    Each medal is hand packaged in an exquisite, black matte finish presentation case and is accompanied by a companion booklet detailing the evolution of our Nation’s symbol.

    The American Liberty 225th Anniversary Silver Medal is priced at $59.95. Orders will be accepted at the Mint’s online catalog and at 1-800-USA-MINT (872-6468). Hearing- and speech-impaired customers with TTY equipment may order at 1-888-321-MINT. Visit us online to learn more about our shipping options.

    View All Releases

  52. Keep Calm & Stack On! says

    Erik H says, ” What a crappy 225th Anniversary!”


    Truth be told, I’ve been a critic of the US Mint over the years though also, in the same breath, have been their biggest fan – since 2006. And a very loyal and committed customer that has sunk a lot into their product offerings over the past 11 years –

    Though truth be told – $59.95 is insulting, and it is BS!

    If this was a Corporation, with this product offering and pricing strategy, in due time the CEO and Board would be replaced. Sad, sad state of affairs…, fool me once..,

  53. Mint News Blog says

    Thanks — it finally got tipped out of whatever satellite bucket it was sitting in and made it to my email.

  54. joe#2 says

    It’s a pity i ( as well ), Am NOT buying from the U S Mint. They seem to be very lazy or just doesn’t give a rats butt. I have been dealing with the Royal Australian Mint and love there proof coins ( especially the 2017 gold proof southern sky coin ). Low mintage, Excellent workmanship, As well as “imagination”. I would love to deal as well with the U S Mint, But until something changes there, I will not. Same buffaloes, Same American eagles, la dee da..

  55. cagcrisp says

    For those looking for More and More Low Mintage Wonders…

    …You’re going to get what you want…

    For those wanting the US Mint to be More and More like the other world mints…

    …You’re going to get what you want…

    The mint has Finally ran out of options…

    Demographics don’t lie…

    This will be more the norm going forward…

    Lower and Lower mintages and Higher and Higher premiums…

    I wouldn’t be surprised to see a new Gold pricing matrix and Higher prices for the P pucks…

    I don’t see Any other options…

  56. Asherspapa says

    dogmash47 wins the prize @ 139.95, but jeffgene is the “funniest” with the subtitle, “SPECIAL PRE-SALE PRICING! LIMITED TIME ONLY” @ $99.95. Pathetically, it seems there are already two sucker buyers at that price! Only proves there are a few bigger idiots than the Mint! This ASL boondoggle along with the Anniversary Set ASE-S have completely destroyed any minimal good will the Mint generated among collectors with the Lincoln P penny.
    Years ago, I gave up stamp collecting when the USPS turned the old 4-stamp plate blocks into 20 (or more)-stamp side strips…it was getting too expensive just to buy the new issues, which would NEVER appreciate in value. In fact, they would actually decline as postage rates increased since they would no longer even pay for mailing a letter. It looks like my coin collection could be heading in the same direction if the Mint continues this kind of pure profiteering behavior. (Sorry for the rant, but the ASL price really, really pisses me off!

  57. Asherspapa says

    LAST POST ABOUT THIS, but OMG….jeffscoins indicated 3 sold at @ $133.67. If any of those buyers are reading, I have a bridge in Brooklyn I’d be willing to sell.

  58. Throckmorton says

    What a crappy 225th anniversary indeed!

    There is so much they could have done…….like maybe strike up so of the more notable patterns which may not have required special legislation…..but no, we get this.


  59. gatortreke says

    @Keep Calm & Stack On:
    If this was a Corporation, with this product offering and pricing strategy, in due time the CEO and Board would be replaced. Sad, sad state of affairs…, fool me once..,

    Perhaps you’ve unintentionally struck on one of the major problems, there is no Mint Director and there hasn’t been one since Moy stepped down, thus they have no “CEO”. The Mint Director is not one of the most prominent or important appointees by each president but it is important for the organization to have a designated leader to steer the ship. The USM appears to be rudderless without a Director with decisions appearing to be made by in a random, haphazard manner, almost like throwing darts at a dartboard or asking a Magic 8 Ball and getting disconnected answers.

    I was looking forward to the upcoming medals, ready to purchase, but am taken aback by the press release.

  60. Gary Not Dave says

    I don’t get what the stink is over the (P) (W) (S) minted eagles…the TPG’s have been doing it since 2011 on the (S) and even earlier on the (W). Is it that big of a deal that they are doing the (P) now? I don’t care if an Eagle carries a mint mark or not but I like knowing what Mint minted the coin. Like always, the only stink is not everybody in the World can have one.

    And FYI….the US Mint NEVER intentionally makes a coin that will increase in value on the secondary market. EVER!

  61. Gary Not Dave says

    I will say it again…..If the Mint put a 22k mintage on this 225th Ann. It would sell out in minutes.
    But with unlimited wont sell 22k.

    Wanna bet?

  62. gatortreke says

    I agree with Gary Not Dave on the mintage limit. I suggested to my coin buddy that the USM set a 22,500 limit on the medals. The number is almost twice the individual limit on last years medals and the first 3 digits represents the anniversary year “225”. I believe this would create demand and support a higher price, not sure it would support $59.95 but higher than last years asking price. Alas….

  63. sharks2th says

    I wonder if they’ll sell more gold 225s than they sell of the silver 225s? At least the gold is monetized.

  64. says

    All of a sudden, the $1,690 gold Liberty coin appears to the best ‘value play’ of the 225th offerings,

    Who wuda thunk dat?!

  65. says

    sharks2th – that’s probably a real possibility now,

    Or at least the 4-medal set, who’s going to pay $200 for 4 Medals of the same design that’s likely Mint to Demand & available for 2 years?

    Not I, young man.

    Besides, IMO, only 2 of the 4 medals are desirable.., the Enchanted and Reverse Proof.

  66. says

    sharks2th – I liked you assessment of this year’s APE, & concur.

    Thinking it’ll get off to a slow start and creep in with 6-7,000 in sales, it won’t make much of an impression relative the past few years.

  67. cagcrisp says

    @Gary Not Dave “But with unlimited wont sell 22k.

    Wanna bet?”

    I Like a man with conviction and the guts to put it out there Before the fact and not After the fact.

    That being said, I will take that bet. I will take the Over on 22k…

  68. data dave says

    Sounds like a new round of predictions. I’ll go with opening day of 25K and s stalling at 50K a month later. Nothing else to buy at that price so I plan to get one.

  69. sharks2th says

    @KCSO – I’d have considered getting the 225th Silvers if they were coins even though the prices are a ripoff. I do like the enhanced designs on coins. I’m just not excited by a medal so I will not be participating in the 225th medal offering. I do think this design looks better in silver. Some designs look better in one metal than they do in another metal.

  70. Tinto says

    Looking at the photos of the packaging for the gold and silver .. I think the Mint probably used the same type of box (similar to what was done for the gold tributes last year)… so there should have been some savings in keeping the basic specs … with changes in the outside packaging and other areas like the booklet (will it be the same inside?) etc to indicate that this is for a silver medal …

  71. cagcrisp says

    The mint is now offering an American Silver Eagle Proof “bundle ”

    $107.90 for a 2016 and 2017 American Silver Eagle Proof

    Sold separately the total would be?

    I wonder which marketing genius thought this up

    You can’t make this stuff up…

  72. John Q. Coinage says

    With the current mess in DC & the snail`s pace of POTUS` appointments, the mint director job won’t likely be even nominated for a long time, maybe Jared Kushner, he likes $$$….seriously $60 for a ag round medal, are there that many collectors of such ? Happy 225th When is the silver center cent restrike? Or the Flowing Hair Dollar in silver? Perhaps a 225th Anniversary GOLD $10….no we get sloppy seconds….. I have reduced my mint purchases by @ least 50% a year over the past 2 years & this year so far……maybe spent $300… I just don’t care anymore, they cooked this golden goose the mint braintrust did…. I still have avoided a WL au, on ebay they are less than the mint price…..’usually” unless you NEED a “7o”

  73. Scott says

    @ John Q. ZERO 2017 Mint purchases for me and I’m not sure if I will buy anything else at this point.

  74. Tinto says


    Wow, this Mint is going downhill fast…. I thought they had touched bottom but noooo

    I think the Mint probably “envisioned” they would sell a bundle of the 30th Anniversary Proof ASEs …. and to make sure I guess, they even stuffed it into the Reagan C&C set with its mintage of 150k without even a mention on the folder as to why it was there … I only bought the Reagan set because I wanted to complete the Prez C&C set collection .. that Anniversary ASE is so pathetically uninspiring .. JMO

  75. earthling says

    People are voting with their feet to show all their love for the US Mints lackluster performance the past decade or so. About the time the super rich played a big poker game with housing and drove down the world economy, that’s about when it all came apart. It’s all about the haves vs the have nots now. But that f course its always been that way but there used to be a middle class. No more!

    Things change. Everyone has to figure out for themselves what the game is and where they fit into it . There’s one thing I’ve figured out ,which is the US Mint has very little I need to pee my money away on. Better to spend it on Food, Shelter and even a Book or two.

  76. earthling says

    This “America the Beautiful” Program from the US Mint has been a great idea for the American People. The Program has pointed out some great attractions in this nation of ours, some of which we might never had heard of.

    If a family were to visit a few of these sites in lieu of wasting the $150 cost of a Coin, they’d have memories that were priceless.

    That’s going to be my plan. No more useless lumps for me. But give me some great destinations.

    For that, US Mint, you’ve earned my gratitude. But just keep those failed Coin designs.


  77. Dustyroads says

    “The mint is now offering an American Silver Eagle Proof “bundle ”

    $107.90 for a 2016 and 2017 American Silver Eagle Proof”

    Thanks for the laugh.

  78. Hidalgo says

    Modern Coin Mart is selling the 2017 S American Silver Eagle coins in packs of 10, 20, 40, and 100. I guess they bought too many and need to get rid of their excess inventory.

    I guess we know part of the reason why these coins sold out in 2 minutes…. LOL.

    Note to self: it does not pay to be greedy.

  79. earthling says

    So what will happen when the other 2017-S SAE’s come out in the 2017 LESP Sets? Well I’d say look for some rare TPG Labeled Coins to hit the market. Prices should be crazy but what will the real value be?

    The smart money has got to be seeing the writing on the wall. Time to dump those Congratulations Sets ASAP.

  80. Buzz Killington says

    See, @earthling, and you thought you struck out at the coin show! Actually, you struck while the iron was about as hot as it was going to get.

  81. says

    Not a recommendation to buy,

    Just a FYI –

    As it’s been posted numerous times, that this day was going..,

    & it’s just started

  82. says

    Not a recommendation to buy,

    Just a FYI –

    As it’s been posted numerous times, that this day was going..,

    & it’s just started…

  83. Barry says

    I’m waiting for a e-mail on the silver Krugerrand for 30.00. I’ve seen it on a couple sites for around 50.00 so maybe the ice will crack some more on that one.

  84. Barry says

    OT- Apmex is selling random year proof 1 oz. AGE’s in OGP for 100. over spot.

  85. KC&SO says

    Erik H says
    JUNE 8, 2017 AT 7:58 PM

    Hidalgo & KCSO,

    I just opened my email and saw the MCM e-blast! LOL

    While funny, isn’t it sad?

  86. KC&SO says

    Barry says
    JUNE 8, 2017 AT 8:09 PM

    I’m waiting for a e-mail on the silver Krugerrand for 30.00. I’ve seen it on a couple sites for around 50.00 so maybe the ice will crack some more on that one.

    We’re down to $43 on one site..,

    Wait patiently.., my strike price is <$30,

    & it's coming, in due time

  87. gatortreke says

    There has been a lot of discussion about the Liberty medal and the price and I’m as shocked as anyone. That said, one point that has been raised is that it is not a coin. In some circumstances I can see the merit in this argument because there is value in the it being dollar denominated.

    Yet there are coins that are dollar denominated such as much of what the RCM produces that to me have no added value to it because the item is dollar denominated. The RCM appears to randomly attach dollar amounts to their various commemorative coins, leaving me perplexed as to what the dollar denomination is supposed to convey. The fact that these have been practically demonetized as illustrated by their $20 for $20 program and the inability to cash these in at any financial institution tells me they are in essence, glorified medals.

    When compared to much of what the RCM produces, these Liberty medals appear to be a “bargain”. By US Mint standards, these are outrageously priced. There is a part of me that says the truth probably is somewhere in between. I’m conflicted as to whether I should buy one or not.

    Opinions? Advice?

  88. cagcrisp says

    You can mark June 7, 2017 as the Start of the End for the US Mint as we know it…

    (Technically you could say the 2016 Mint summit was the first domino to fall)…

  89. gatortreke says

    cagcrisp: Can we change the date to June 6? It would be symbolic and a lot easier to remember as the USM’s D-Day.

  90. Dustyroads says

    gatortreke, The medal is uniquely American, produced by the USM, and carries the same features as a denominated USM coin. Taking all those facts into consideration, one could easily put it into a much higher category than a simple round from a private mint. Is this one going to be a hit that will go down in history and be fondly remembered? I wish it were. Maybe you should consider this one because it marks a time which caused so much of a disruption that I doubt any of us will be ever able to forget it. I can’t really think of a better reason to buy it. Surely it will lose some value before long.

  91. HarryB says

    @gatortreke: as to an “opinion or advice” as to purchase, is the Liberty medal within your collecting interest or do you like the design? If so then purchase, if not, pass, or, as others have noted, pick the Liberty medal at some future point when the price stabilizes close to melt on the secondary market. As @cag observes, the Mint has chosen the worst possible path on marketing the Liberty medal offering. Sad. Harry

  92. cagcrisp says

    Another blow to Populism in the UK. Major blow to Populism in the French election and now the UK.

    Love it…

  93. earthling says

    400 oz Gold Good Delivery List Bar

    It is quite common for central banks and high net worth investors to buy 400 oz gold bars as a great way to own physical gold bullion at a low premium or price per ounce compared to the fluctuating gold spot price. All the 400 oz gold bars we offer are crafted in fine .9999 gold bullion bar. We sell some of the world’s most highly regarded 400 oz gold bullion bar hallmarks including the 400 oz Metalor gold bar, 400 oz Heraeus gold bar, 400 oz Royal Canadian Mint (RCM) gold bar, 400 oz PAMP gold bar, and other respected 400 oz gold ingot hallmarks.

    Central Bank Gold Bars

    Manufacturers of the 400 oz gold bars we offer are all named on industry-standard “good delivery list”. Every 400 oz gold bullion bar we offer is guaranteed to be recognized by bullion dealers the world over as central bank gold bars, and thus they will retain their resale value regardless of their age or specific Good Delivery gold bar brand.

    Buy 400 oz Gold Good Delivery List Bar
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    Sell 400 oz Gold Good Delivery List Bar

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    Great News! You can buy big bars of Gold just like you’re on the same level as the Federal Government!


  94. sharks2th says

    I didn’t think they would publish a notice in the federal register for the medals since the news release earlier the week, but it will be published Monday:

    United States Mint
    Pricing for the 2017 American Liberty 225th Anniversary Silver Medal
    Agency: United States Mint, Department of the Treasury.
    ACTION: Notice.
    SUMMARY: The United States Mint is announcing the price of the 2017 American Liberty
    225th Anniversary Silver Medal. Each medal will be priced at $59.95. The silver medals will be
    minted at the United States Mint at Philadelphia.
    FOR FURTHER INFORMATION CONTACT: Katrina McDow, Marketing Specialist,
    Numismatic and Bullion Directorate; United States Mint; 801 9th Street, NW; Washington, DC
    20220; or call 202-354-8495.
    Authority: 31 U.S.C. 5111(a)(2)
    Dated: June 5, 2017.
    Jean Gentry
    Chief Counsel
    United States Mint
    [FR Doc. 2017-12034 Filed: 6/9/2017 8:45 am; Publication Date: 6/12/2017]

  95. You Can't See Me says

    I will wait for the price to come down on the Liberty medals before purchasing. It is usually a good idea to buy medals as close to melt price as possible. The prices just don’t hold up over time.
    You can pick up the 2003 National Wildlife Refuge medals at close to melt with mintages of 25k for three of the four. 9-11 medals,at melt as well. Also the 1965 Liberty Series for little over melt. Their mintages are 5k and under.

    Still interested to know the mintage on the four medal set. I think that one will be 50k which may be the next flipper opportunity.

  96. cagcrisp says

    Fractional Gold American Liberty coins.

    As I’ve said before the Mint HAS to come up with more revenue and fractional Gold whether it is a Buffalo or an American Liberty is what the Mint HAS to do.

    There should be virtually NO debate on the merits of whether to do fractionals or not.

    The only suggestion I would have is a 1/20 oz. Gold that I have proposed in the past.

    The Mint NEEDS the income and Gold is the way to get there.

    There are some on the CCAC that do NOT want any more re-hashing of “Old” designs , thus the American Liberty Gold fractionals vs. Buffalo fractionals.

    For me personally, this is a Hail Mary ( Too Little Too Late)

    The Modern Mint ship is taking on water…

  97. Mattarch says

    I will not be ordering the 225th
    anniversary silver medal from the Mint. Waiting for the secondary market price to stabilize seems like a good idea.

    For Comparison Shipping purposes I ordered a 2017 Silver Proof Set and 2017 Uncirculated coin set from the Mint on Wednesday. The same day I ordered the 2 oz. Queen’s Beast Dragon and some other silver coins from an online bullion dealer. The bullion is scheduled to arrive on Saturday, the Mint’s web site still shows Processing.

  98. Throckmorton says

    I just picked up my UNC AGEs at the post office. The box was handed to me half opened so I made the agent wait while I confirmed the contents. I was able to open the pack with my hand because it was only half sealed with sticky glue. When I shut it back, there was no evidence that it had been opened.

    Fortunately the contents were as expected. I can’t believe how slack the Mint and it’s contractors have become.

    I also noticed that Priority Mail is only insured for $100.

  99. Tom says

    Same problems just a different day. I have, and will have to continue complaining about the SLOPPY way products are allowed to be shipped. When anyone spends any amount with OUR mint, the product should be handled with care and just a little bit of pride. I guess I ask for too much.

  100. earthling says

    ” The Modern Mint ship is taking on water… ”

    Cagcrisp the Mint people won’t realize whats going on till the ship has slipped beneath the waves.

  101. Throckmorton says

    There are some on the CCAC that would like to perpetuate the current Liberty design. Maybe they should just go ahead and have that design for all of our coinage and be done with it.

  102. earthling says

    The comments in the MNB Post linked above are really interesting. Having a blast reading them !

  103. KCSO says

    SD Bullion now has the Privateer Whale, while a low price relative to other retailers, still priced too high for my blood. This to, I shall wait out…, these coin retailers are really helping me work on a personal improvement goal, my patience.

    I’ll buy the Whale when it’s at $42-$43.

    I have yet to purchase a Silver Krugerrand, and have no intentions until it comes back into earthing’s orbit of high $20’s, maybe $33 I’ll go.

  104. KCSO says

    Per the Mint’s website –


    Our dads lead by example, and Father’s Day is that special time for letting them know how much you appreciate their leadership. This year, consider Father’s Day gifts honoring leaders they might admire, such as Presidents Ronald Reagan or Barack Obama.

    Something very fundamentally flawed of the association in the last sentence.., I think I may barf 🤢

    Speaking of 🤢’ing, I still can’t fathom how the mint is justifying, IN THEIR OWN REALITY, a price of $59.95 for that medal.., unbelievable.

  105. KCSO says

    Per Sharks2th posting above –

    The FR notice stated –

    “Each medal will be priced at $59.95”

    That just jumped out at me, that is worded very odd. While I may be reading into it too much, it sure leaves one with the impression that the above notice was written to be leveraged for the next medal release as well. The wording is just strange.

    Surely in the 4 medal set, each medal WILL NOT be priced at $59.95 as well.

  106. Xena says

    KCSO – agree with you on the White Whale. Not sure why this one is coming out so much higher, but I am going to wait also. Spot was quite a bit higher the only time I paid over $43.

    I have my 10 oz QB Lion sitting out on display in my… coin office?? Anyway, it catches my eye every time I walk by – a great looking piece, still not tired of it.

  107. KCSO says

    If I had earthling’s overtime bank roll, this is how I would blow it –

    2017 GB Prf 1 kilo Gold Queen’s Beast Unicorn (Box & COA)

    One of 25 coins to be minted,

    this magnificent coin features a magical Unicorn leaping over a shield. Part of the incredibly popular Queen’s Beast series, this coin is sure to be a sought-after collector’s item.

    APMEX has there Unicorn QB Proof’s pre orders almost ready to be release.

    MNB – you all may want to post your link when that happens, I’ll be dropping some good coin

  108. KCSO says

    Xena – isn’t it awesome? I love mine, I’m committed to the 10 oz series now, dropped the pucks like a hot potatoe and doing QB’s.

  109. KCSO says

    Xena – there’s a lot of gamesmanship going on with the retailers now, that’s why.

    They released it internationally, and then systematically releasing to various retailers to support an artificial floor.

    Provident is own by Elemental, the manufactured. Provident has yet to offer it for sale, they will, and when they do, the price then will be lowered. I’ll wait until Provident offers it, and then buy from them, SD BU, or JM BU. The price will come down in line to the Captain, this summer.

    The same thing is happen with the Silver Krug.., as more domestic retailers offer it, the price has been coming down. SD BU offered it 2 weeks ago for as low as $39.., so it’s happening.., just gotta wait these things out.

    Soon it’ll be yesterday’s news, MCM will have 800,000 left of the 1,000,000, mintage, and then they’ll be fireside sales.

    Talk about collusion. It’s really beginning to irk me and I’m growing tired of it.

    Going forward, I’m sticking with buying near spot with the QB’s, the Call of the Wild golds, Privateers, and that’s about it.., reduced my outlays about 80% this year.

  110. Xena says

    Louis – really liked your Numismatist article about the Aurora Australis. All that technical detail about the Southern (or Northern) lights way more interesting and understandable to me than economics and monetary policy (although I do thank all you smart MNBers that have taught me a lot about that over the past 3 years).

    The Southern Lights coin is a bit too pricey for me for 1 oz of silver so probably won’t be picking one up. But seeing the Northern lights (or Southern Lights for that matter) are on my bucket list.

  111. earthling says

    ” KCSO says

    JUNE 9, 2017 AT 7:31 PM

    If I had earthling’s overtime bank roll, this is how I would blow it –

    2017 GB Prf 1 kilo Gold Queen’s Beast Unicorn (Box & COA)

    One of 25 coins to be minted, ”

    Hey wait a minute here. If I were in the market for 1 kilo of anything…. it sure couldn’t be Au. Maybe 1 kg of sand for an Ant Farm?


  112. Karl Meyer says

    cagcrisp I think it is time to start a poll on the four coin am. liberty medals after seeing what the mint is pricing the individual medals and MTD my uneducated guess is they will mint 50,000 coins in 12,500 sets priced at $225.00 per set and a 5 min sellout. that will be the anniversary bone thrown to the flippers.

  113. Scott says

    My guesstimate: Who cares? I wouldn’t buy them at 20% over spot, much less the sky-high rip-off prices the U.S. Mint will charge. If these sell out in five minutes, you can bank on the big boys getting most of them and flipping them to fools at even higher prices.

  114. TemplePriestess says

    It seems the mints thought process is, sell the over priced coins and medals to the big coin dealers. Over time the coin dealers will be forced to put the coins on sale, at which time true coin collectors will get what they want. It’s like the U.S. mint doesn’t want the small time collector to deal directly with them anymore.

  115. cagcrisp says

    $59.95 for the American Liberty Silver Medal

    Everyone is asking Why ? Why ? Why?

    …And I’m asking…

    Why Not? Why Not? Why Not?

    In 2016 there were a Total of 24,359 American Liberty Silver Medals sold @ $34.95 for a Total of $851,347.05

    To get the SAME Revenue as 2016 the Mint will only need to sell 14,201 of the 2017 “P” medals.

    My Guesstimate is they will Ball Park 20k sales on Launch Day

    ~ 20,000 @ $59.95 = $1,199,000 or an Increase in Revenue of 41% and a Considerable Increase in Profit

    …SO…I ask Why Not ? Why Not? Why Not?

    The Mint has created these non monetized medals for a revenue/profit stream SO…

    …That’s what you are getting…

    The Mint will Continue down the road of Higher and Higher prices and Lower and Lower mintages…

  116. cagcrisp says

    @Karl Meyer “liberty medals after seeing what the mint is pricing the individual medals and MTD my uneducated guess is they will mint 50,000 coins in 12,500 sets priced at $225.00 per set and a 5 min sellout.”

    IF I was the Mint that would be very similar to what I would do. Maybe not agree with your pricing or your sales numbers but I very much agree with your Thought process (along with KCSO’s)

    IF I was the Mint Before the Launch of the 4 coins set, I would take the TOTAL sales numbers for the American Liberty Silver medal and take a percentage of that numbers, reduce the price/coin SOMEWHAT and put a mintage limit on that

    Let’s say there are a Total of 25,000 medals sold Before the Launch of the 4 coin set, then I would put a Mintage Limit of 20,000 and a 4 coin price of say $189.95 (KCSO’s number) and then…

    …Buyers will break the door down to get the “Limited” mintage at the “Bargain” price…

    Let’s say that exact number is sold of the 4 coin set: 20,000 @ $189.95 = $3,799,000 plus the Already mentioned 25,000 @ $59.95 = $1,498,750 for a grand Total of $5,297,750 with still available “P” to be sold @ $59.95

    That compares to a TOTAL of $851,347.05 for the 2016 American Liberty Silver medal

    …SO…Just like the 2017S ASE, the Mint is playing people like a drum…

  117. Barry says

    The risk may be if over time prices fall in the secondary market then there will be reluctance to buy in the future. The comem coins are a example. btw , I wonder if a organization will ever get money again except for once in a blu moon.

  118. Gary Not Dave says

    Yep..i will be rght! Under 22k….With that price for sure!

    Now if they would of said $59.95 and a total mintage of 14k….SELL OUT!

  119. says

    It would be very wascally wabbitty of the mint to sell it out at 22,500 unannounced..,

    Then run the 4 coin set unlimited MTD

  120. earthling says

    I once thought I was waiting on the Apollo 11 Commemorative and possibly a HR 1921 Peace Dollar Tribute from the US Mint. Well I bought a small hoard of “1917” Peace Dollars, and “1964” Morgans Dollars from Dan Carrs Moonlight Mint and as of now I really am done with the US Mint. There’s really nothing about the US Mint that interests me except their puzzling marketing moves. I suppose I can relate to someone on a Lifeboat as they watch the Titanic go down.

  121. Dustyroads says

    earthling, it’s good to spread out your interests. The USM aren’t total losers, there will be some cool things coming from them before long. I like the idea of the Pd coins which will hopefully hit the market. And I like the way Pd keeps inching up. Not your premier metal for coins, but it’s definitely slowly moving higher. There may be a stronger market for Pd coins if it continues up and gets some attention. Anyway, I should be able to snag one when the time comes.

  122. Louis Golino says

    @Xena- Thanks for the feedback on the So. Lights coin. But did you see the cover?? That’s mine too. The long article on how to improve the designs on our coins. Also, what do you think of the new price guide from the Greysheet company? I am waiting for the silver and gold ones in the coming months.

    As for the MCM blast on 2017-S- once again only the 69’s are discounted, and the price still represents a solid profit esp. on high volume. 70’s are still five times issue or more if special labels.

    As for the whales- You guys and girls should shop around. I have to be careful about recommending specific companies but there is one that has a better price than the one mentioned above and they have free shipping over $100.

  123. Louis Golino says

    Also re: fractionals- For bullion we may see 1/20th but if the Liberty gold is made smaller, I highly doubt it would be that small, more like a 1/4 oz. and also it was not the CCAC’s idea. It is a Mint proposal, which the CCAC is going to discuss.

  124. Barry says

    I would also suggest getting on the e-mail list for the large dealers and you’ll get info on sales and so on.

  125. Xena says

    Louis – love the design of the cover coin, but sorry I didn’t notice that was also your article. I don’t usually have time to read the whole magazine, but I do read your usual monthly article as soon as the mag comes.

    Although now I’ll also check to see which version of the greysheet is in that month. I think it’s great that ANA and CDN have teamed up this way.

    Have a houseful of people coming over tomorrow – will check out your other article whenever I decompress from that.

  126. Louis Golino says

    Thanks, Xena. I understand completely and hope your event goes well. You’ve been a great online friend.

  127. Dustyroads says

    I don’t know about some of you, but I suspect you have been watching, but Palladium is continuing an upward climb.
    If the USM doesn’t release their new Pd 1 oz. this year, I’m inclined to think they really are off their proverbial rocker.

  128. billsey says

    Quick PSA for collectors of the Austria Niobium series. If you haven’t ordered the Microcosm for 2017 yet, you may want to check in with Apmx today. They have a fairly “competitive” price, 10 left as I write this. Don’t say I didn’t tell you…

  129. Dustyroads says

    The latest on Palladium-

    From the article:

    “The background for palladium is for good industrial demand and likely a significant market deficit this year, and on top of course you’ve got this speculative squeeze,” Mitsubishi analyst Jonathan Butler said. “The backwardation has got a lot steeper in the last day. Metal for immediate delivery is very tight, and that is being reflected in those forward rates moving into an even steeper backwardation.”

  130. johnaz says

    Boy that guy on HSN had new labels Black eagle,One day only labels I think its time to put a stop to this.


    johnaz- I am watching , and listening to that same crap. New collectors will think that labels, are more important than the coin itself. IMO this will kill the hobby when they find out they have been played.

  132. Drew S says

    I would love to see someone show me one of those ‘HSN’ labeled Silver Eagle Coins. Cause I’d be able to tell who’s the Donkey in the room.

  133. gatortreke says

    Thanks to billsey (and confirmed by Louis) re: the new Austrian niobium coin. APMEX is currently $15 less than the Royal Scandinavian Mint.

    Speaking of the niobium coins, did anyone else here order the Palau Solar System Saturn niobium coin from First Coin? The coin was supposed to be shipped first in April, then in May. It is now almost mid June and they are telling me it will ship soon. I see a listing for the coin by firstcoin on ebay with the note it will ship in 3 days from order. Why can they promise such quick shipping via ebay but slow shipping for someone who placed an order back in February?

  134. MarkInFlorida says

    It looks like the platinum proof will come out the first day of the July Orlando F.U.N. show. Does that mean the Mint will probably have them on hand at the show?

  135. KC&SO says

    There’s is no reason to have a HHL on this year’s APE,

    just another example, among a sea of examples, that if there’s a Product Manager at the U.S Mint, they simple have no understanding of their core customer base across so many facets

  136. KC&SO says

    It still boggles my mind that the USM would release a first of its kind, complementary silver piece to the successful gold ’15 Liberty, limited release Silver Medal with a potential of ONLY 6,250 orders across 25,000 of a ‘W’ & ‘S’ offering at $34.95.

    And then within 10 months release another Proof finish medal at $59.95 and unlimited, with a big honking box.

    All about the revenue and sticking it to the base.

  137. says

    225th Anniversay Uncirculated Set –

    Is most likely up next in late July or August.

    Has anyone read or seen elsewhere if this will be a PM or clad offering?

    I suspect more overpriced clad, though that’s just a hunch.

  138. earthling says

    Marketing people are all about the money. Come to think of it…. hmmmm….. isn’t everyone, everywhere , all about the money? Maybe the demand for that Gold version is known to be high but folks aren’t biting because the price is a bit high (being Gold and all). The marketing people see big potential to rake it in with the Silver?

    Well if the Silver medals sell 500,000 @ $59.95 someone will deserve an ovation! If they sell 40,000 over 2 years then they still get a hi-five from me – at least. ✋

  139. cagcrisp says

    ANYONE want to put a Guesstimate out for Launch week sales for the Liberty Silver Medat @ $59.95 ?

    I’m not keeping up with Long Term Sales because they will be around for a couple of years


  140. says


    Driven by mostly delears, they must feed the machine

    I won’t be participating,

    When it’s all said and done, I’m of the opinion that sales will be lacking, maybe not dismal, but lacking

  141. cagcrisp says

    Guesstimate for Launch Week for the American Liberty Silver Medal:

    KCSO 17,000
    cagcrisp 20,157

  142. cagcrisp says

    Guesstimate for Launch Week for the American Liberty Silver Medal:

    KCSO 17,000
    cagcrisp 20,157
    Tom 20,158

  143. says

    Palladium (PALL) Surges To 16-Year Highs

    The ETFS Physical Palladium Shares (NYSE:PALL) is in focus these days, as the underlying precious metal rises to levels not seen since 2001.

    Palladium jumped 7% on Friday alone, spurred by co-called backwardation in the market. Backwardation is a phenomenon in commodities where the futures prices for an asset are below the spot price, which normally causes a sharp short-term rally.

    Reuters reports that a combination of rising demand and weak supply are also partially to blame for palladium’s run:

    “The background for palladium is for good industrial demand and likely a significant market deficit this year, and on top of course you’ve got this speculative squeeze,” Mitsubishi analyst Jonathan Butler said.

    “The backwardation has got a lot steeper in the last day. Metal for immediate delivery is very tight, and that is being reflected in those forward rates moving into an even steeper backwardation.”

    Traders reported a reluctance to lend the metal, suggesting tightness in near-term supply.
    Chart patterns indicate that the metal is vulnerable to a sell-off from these elevated levels, however, technical analysts said.

    Palladium continues to be a standout among precious metals. As gold and silver continue to trade in a tight range, the lesser-known palladium’s rally has gained serious momentum, with the metal gaining nearly 60% over the trailing twelve months.

    The ETFS Physical Palladium Shares (NYSE:PALL) closed at $84.38 on Friday, up $2.44 (+2.98%). Year-to-date, PALL has gained 29.40%, versus a 8.89% rise in the benchmark S&P 500 index during the same period.

    PALL currently has an ETF Daily News SMART Grade of A (Strong Buy), and is ranked #4 of 33 ETFs in the Precious Metals ETFs category.

    Was a SMART Buy, a year or two ago 😉

  144. jayjaspersgarage on ebay says

    KCSO says
    JUNE 12, 2017 AT 10:16 AM

    Bloody FANG Monday!

    Yeppers KSCO, from Friday to today and how many more days? Greed has a way of coming back to slap us in the wallet from time to time. This summer might be quite painful for the younger investors.

    I listen to Jim Cramer and FANG is one of his better coined acronyms.

  145. cagcrisp says


    Taking a Hit on Friday and Today…


    I would NOT be crying for anyone that has been in these stocks for a period of time…

    Down and Dirty YTD for the FAANGs (Point in time as of Posting)…

    FB YTD +27%
    AAPL YTD +27%
    AMZN YTD +29%
    NFLX YTD +20%
    GOOG YTD+ 20%

  146. Xena says

    earthling – no, not everyone, everywhere is all about the money… although I agree with you that it certainly seems that way sometimes – we like to hear about the flashy, not the subdued.

  147. sharks2th says

    @KCSO – The rise in Pd could also be due to the “large” bullion purchase by the USM for the possible Pd Mercury Eagle. They would need to garner the 10k+ ounces needed to make these later this year. That is a pretty big demand all at once. I’m just guessing they will set the mintage around 10k based on what they have done in recent years with the Pt eagles. If they go with 25k , 50k or 75k, then the drag on the Pd market would be greater to fill that big order. It does seem the precious metals tend to rise before many of the USM offerings. Occasionally we get lucky and get a category drop just before a release.

    You also have to keep in mind they will need more than the number of ounces they sell because the planchet manufacturer will stamp the planchets out of sheets of the metal. I’m not sure what the excess is. Cag or Louis may be able to provide a reference as to how many ounces you get out of a sheet weighing X ounces. This would allow you to figure out how much excess you’d need to stamp out each ounce. Of course the excess can be melted down into new sheets, but you will always have some excess. It is like making biscuits. When you cut out the biscuits with your circular cutter, you have extra dough between the circles you either re-roll and reuse or just make some odd shaped biscuits.

  148. MintyFresh says

    77 yr old collector leaving the hobby and sharing lessons learned.

    He seems to have 1 VERY important lesson to convey to any who would listen…

    • Do not purchase anything from the United States Mint

    • The U.S. Mint manufactures coins and commemoratives in such huge quantities that they are essentially worthless

    • Personal safety deposit boxes and dealer shelves are overflowing with U.S. Mint items that will never come close to selling at their original issue price

  149. Larry says

    The 77 year old collector is looking at collecting as an investment. Nothing wrong with that. I look at it as an enjoyable hobby, and if I happen to make some money when I sell that is fine, but that is not most important to me. I just enjoy the coins.
    When I do decide to sell, I know I will at least get melt value. So I may make a little money, or lose a little money. That does not include the enjoyment I got out the hobby. I don’t know how to put a price on that.

  150. earthling says


    Yeah I saw that one. I got tons of useless/worthless junk stored away. What to do with it all? The PM Stuff – no problem. The Clad State Quarters – spend them I guess. A new infusion of Minty 1999-on Quarters ought to create a smidgen of excitement.


  151. John Q. Coinage says

    2017 AG HR Medal, will sell 11,300 on opening day. Total sales after 1 1/2 years will be 55,000…… Palladium ‘value’ proof will be priced @ $1,44o……ya’ll will see, the mint loves to chum the waters….

  152. cagcrisp says


    Taking a Hit on Friday and Today…


    Guesstimate for Launch Week for the American Liberty Silver Medal:

    KCSO 17,000
    cagcrisp 20,157
    Tom 20,158
    John Q. Coinage 11,300

  153. cagcrisp says

    Guesstimate for Launch Week for the American Liberty Silver Medal:

    KCSO 17,000
    cagcrisp 20,157
    Tom 20,158
    John Q. Coinage 11,300

  154. cagcrisp says

    Guesstimate for Launch Week for the American Liberty Silver Medal:

    KCSO 17,000
    cagcrisp 20,157
    Tom 20,158
    John Q. Coinage 11,300
    Alex in MA 27,000

  155. earthling says

    Hurry Hurry Hurry … step right up folks 😃😀😆😊😎💩💕

    Currently there are 14 Jackie Kennedy BU First Spouse Gold Coins left at the US Mint. At only $820.00, this might be a deal. Especially if Gold were to shoot up to some really high spot value.

    When you compare it to a 1 oz HR American Liberty Gold Coin, you might see value. 👈

  156. Throckmorton says

    Cagcrisp – splitting the differences between the two current low ballers……..I say 14,150.

  157. cagcrisp says

    Guesstimate for Launch Week for the American Liberty Silver Medal:

    KCSO 17,000
    cagcrisp 20,157
    Tom 20,158
    John Q. Coinage 11,300
    Alex in MA 27,000
    Throckmorton 14,150

  158. cagcrisp says

    Guesstimate for Launch Week for the American Liberty Silver Medal:

    KCSO 17,000
    cagcrisp 20,157
    Tom 20,158
    John Q. Coinage 11,300
    Alex in MA 27,000
    Throckmorton 14,150
    Joe M. 11,111

  159. fmtransmitter says

    Hey MNB’s!! It has been awhile so I wanted to pop in and say hello. I have been learning heavily about the crypto coin world and has taken so many hours, like numismatics did. There are no short cuts and that world is even way shadier than actual coins! So please please please be careful in there!
    On a lighter note, my ARES GODS of WAR came today and I did an unboxing for ya’ll! Words cannot express the High Relief of this stunner in real life! It was worth the long long wait and with only 500 to go around, I will prize this as a major addition to the ol collection. Enjoy and please like and follow if you want. Here’s the link to it…BTW it looks 100 times better in real life. I will look under the loupe soon…

  160. Montana John says

    Medal opening day-16,470..Off Topic If anyone is close to Garryowen Montana and the Crow agency between June 23-25 stop and see the Little Bighorn re-enactment…Custer’s Last Stand.. It’s done quite well I’ve been to it or for the more adventurous coin collector check out you get to actually train and ride with Custer during the re-enactment…disclaimer…I.m not with the Chamber of Commerce

  161. KEITHSTER says

    Will try the bank soon to get some of these they should be in shortly? Lots of medal talk if no one is buying at 60 bucks that’s crazy. Glad I got the last ones on the cheap ! Well Good Luck All “>”>”)

  162. Mark Rex says

    My predictions for AG HR Liberty Coin
    Opening Day 7,500
    Week 1 10,000
    Month 1 12,500

    I have moved to cryptocurrencies lately (still collect coins). Cryptocurrencies especially Ethereum (Ether / ETH) has been on a tear this year. I bought my few coins (digital coins) when it was at $12 per. Now the price is up to nearly $400 per. I have been buying all the way up to and even started mining ETH building a 6x GPU computer. Google Ethereum and read up about it. Its not too late. I recommend a US based company called Coinbase (they have apps as well) to buy and sell ETH (Ethereum), BTC (Bitcoin) and LTC (Litecoin). You can buy using your bank account, wire, credit and debit card. You can sell and get paid out to your bank, check (I think) or PayPal.

    If you use my referral link we will both get $10 worth of BTC once you have bought and or sold $100 or more worth of cryptocurrencies. BTC is at $2630., ETH is at $371. You dont have to buy a whole coin – you can buy a set dollar amount. For example if ETH was at $300 and you bought $100 worth then you would get 0,33333333 ETH (it goes to 8 decimals deep).

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