Bills seek coins commemorating the U.S. Army’s 1st Infantry Division and the National Purple Heart Hall of Honor


The 1st Infantry Division Monument in Washington, D.C. (photo by Ron Cogswell) and a Purple Heart Medal (Wikipedia photo).

Two new bills for commemorative coins, both pertaining to the U.S. military, have been introduced into the U.S. Congress.

The Duty First Act (H.R. 1582) was introduced on March 16 by Representative Steve Russell (R-Okla.). It authorizes a three-coin program to commemorate the 2017 centennial of the U.S. Army’s 1st Infantry Division. The division’s historic accomplishments and honors could, and do, fill books; the following (extremely brief) summary is compiled from the text of the bill.

Constituted on May 24, 1917, the 1st Infantry Division (1 ID) is the first and oldest permanently established combat division of the U.S. Army. It has been in continuous service since its organization, and has fought with distinction in every major conflict since 1917 except the Korean War, when it was on occupation duty in Germany. This year, 2017, is the centennial of the Division.

The 1 ID was the first U.S. division to reach France in World War I; it fired the first American shots of the war; it suffered the first American casualties; and it secured the first American victory. In World War II, the 1 ID was the first to deploy to Europe, and was the lead assault division on Omaha beach in Normandy on D-Day. It was one of the first two combat divisions deployed to Vietnam in 1965, and it deterred Soviet aggression against NATO Europe from 1970 to 1990.

The 1 ID deployed to Saudi Arabia in 1991 in Operations Desert Shield and Desert Storm, and to Iraq in 2004–2005 in OIF II. Its brigade combat teams and other elements deployed multiple times to Iraq and Afghanistan between 2003 and 2014. Its soldiers have deployed to Iraq and Kuwait to assist the Iraqi Security Forces and other friendly countries in that vital and unstable region. The 1 ID will be deployed to Iraq, Afghanistan, and Korea in 2016 and 2017, its centennial year.

Thirty-six 1 ID soldiers have been decorated with the Medal of Honor, and countless others have distinguished themselves in combat. The 1st Infantry Division has served the United States with great valor and distinction since its organization, living up to its motto, “No mission too difficult, no sacrifice too great—Duty First.”

H.R. 1582 calls for a maximum of 20,000 gold $5 coins, 100,000 silver $1 coins, and 200,000 clad half dollars. These coins would be issued during calendar year 2018. The surcharges of $35, $10, and $5 (respectively) would go to the Society of the 1st Infantry Division for renovation of the existing 1st Infantry Division Memorial in Washington, D.C.

The National Purple Heart Hall of Honor Commemorative Coin Act (H.R. 1683) was introduced on March 22 by Representative Sean Patrick Maloney (D-N.Y.). As the bill’s name suggests, the three-coin program would honor recipients of the Purple Heart Medal, with surcharges going to the National Purple Heart Hall of Honor, located in Rep. Maloney’s 18th District. The following is compiled from Section 2 of the bill.

The National Purple Heart Hall of Honor’s mission is to commemorate the extraordinary sacrifice of U.S. servicemen and servicewomen who have been killed or wounded in combat; and to collect and preserve the stories of National Purple Heart recipients from all branches of service and across generations to ensure that all recipients are represented. The Hall of Honor first opened its doors on November 10, 2006, in New Windsor, N.Y. It is located at the New Windsor Cantonment State Historic Site, where General George Washington’s army camped during the Revolutionary War and where he first awarded the Badge of Military Merit, a piece of purple cloth that became the model for the Purple Heart.

The Badge of Military Merit awarded to Elijah Churchill by General George Washington. (Wikipedia photo)

The Badge of Military Merit awarded to Elijah Churchill by General George Washington. (Wikipedia photo)

The National Purple Heart Hall of Honor is the first to recognize the more than 1.7 million servicemembers wounded or killed in action ranging from the American Revolutionary War to the present day, serving as a living memorial to their sacrifice by sharing their stories through interviews, exhibits, and the Roll of Honor, an interactive computer database of each recipient.

H.R. 1683 calls for a maximum of 50,000 gold $5 coins, 400,000 silver $1 coins, and 750,000 clad half dollars. The coins would be issued during calendar year 2020, and the surcharges of $35, $10, and $5 would go to the National Purple Heart Hall of Honor to help finance the construction of a new building and the renovation of existing facilities.

This is not the first time an attempt has been made to stir interest in a commemorative for the National Purple Heart Hall of Honor. The concept first arose as H.R. 3867 in 2014, but died on the vine for lack of interest. It was resurrected in January 2015 as HR 358, but again faltered for lack of support.   ❑

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  1. A&L Futures says

    Just going through some old files and came across this:

    Category I (18-25 years of age) — 0.00%

    Category II (26-35 years of age) – 4%
    a. Majacra
    b. The Real “Cool” Brad

    Category III (36-45 years of age) – 14.5%
    a. A&L Futures
    b. KC&SO
    c. Sith
    d. bg35765
    e. Myth
    f. jj
    g. Brad

    Category IV (46-55 years of age) – 39.5%
    a. Mike in NY
    b. Blair J. Tobler
    c. Xena
    d. Dustyroads
    e. Louis (but he looks younger)
    f. Dan
    g. Rudy (doesn’t look a day over 53)
    h. Don (===> looks 40)
    i. Gatortreke
    j. VaBeachSteve
    k. Sharks2th
    l. CaliSkier
    m. Sherril
    n. DBR
    o. Joe M
    p. GoldFishin
    q. bobo
    r. John C.
    s. fmtransmitter

    Category V (55+ years of age) – 41.6%
    a. 69- z28
    b. Scott
    c. Craig
    d. Mark
    e. Bernie in FL
    f. Olde Sailor Bill
    g. Dave SW FL
    h. John Q. Coinage
    i. Tinto
    j. Oldraremaps
    k. Mattarch (but just barely)
    l. paddy
    m. Silky
    n. tP
    o. Bob Old Big Bird
    p. MontanaJohn
    q. oldfolkie
    r. MGM
    s. MarkInFlorida
    t. Dr. Joe

    Makes we wonder what happened to all these guys/gals.

  2. Tom P. - MA says

    In one of my very few Nostrodamus moments I knew not to order more than one item with the Congrats “set”. My issue was that mine was “trapped” inside the mail box. I live in a complex and the box was firmly wedged in.

    Ignore the trolls. Easier said than done.

    DD, you need a back story. You were travelling in the SF area and received a shiny new 65 nickel while in very close proximity to the mint. I think there actually were 65 nickels made in SF……

  3. Datadave says

    Actually I bought a few rolls from the mint gift shop. They did make coins at all three mints from 65 to 67.

  4. ike says

    WCubes I bought from Gainesville Coins a few times. The one time that sticks in my mind is the2008-W AMERICAN SILVER EAGLE, BURNISHED, REVERSE OF 2007 on a weekend for $69? and after finding out what they were selling for, went back to order several more. they had removed them from the site, but I did get the one.

  5. So Krates says

    Sold a handful of silver Manx Cat coins to them at a show years ago. They quoted me $55 each then when I came back after I couldn’t find a better offer, they paid me $60 each. It was a good in person transaction 🙂

  6. says

    At the current rate it’s going,
    Fredrick Douglas BU puck will be a new low..,

    Animal Crackers just barely nudged over the new low ranking at the last moment.. still holding steady at 20,300

  7. says

    A&L – Nice list!

    Yeah, there’s some very knowledgeable and talented folks in your list, not to mention some great Americans..,

    Here’s a few more I wonder what happened to them..,

    KCSO says
    MARCH 16, 2017 AT 4:47 PM

    “Credibility & Consistency goes a long way.., or I should say went a very long way on this Blog since 2011.

    Hence why I like to see a return of –

    VA Beach Bum (VABB)
    VA Bob (more often)
    VA Beach Ed
    VA Beach Steve
    VA Beach Ed
    Don – with the Toro snow plow
    Xena – more often
    Captain O’kill
    A Gary – whom I never could get straight with the others
    I’m just a Bill
    AK Bob
    Evil Flipper
    And the guys in MT/WY whose names, forgive me, I can’t remember at the moment

    And there’s many others, who names I regrettable cannot recall in the past 3 mintutes, though made MNB a great place to post.”

  8. says

    Need some help here –

    Can you think of mint offerings that had a considerable run up after release?

    Here’s what I have so far:

    ’10 – ???
    ’11 – 25th Anny ASE 5 coin set
    ’12 – ???
    ’13 – ???
    ’14 – ???
    ’14 – Native American C&C set
    ’14 – $5 BHoF
    ’14 – $1 BHoF
    ’15 – APE
    ’15 – Truman C&C
    ’15 – Ike C&C
    ’16 – Silver HR Medal
    ’17 – ‘S’ Congratulations Set

    Think of any others over the past 7 years that shot up on the secondary market?


  9. bg35765 says

    I am one of the names on the list above that has not posted in a long time. As the song goes, “I’m alive and doing fine” and I still lurk here.

    I saw the post about the Congratulations Set, but was on a cruise ship in the middle of the ocean the day it went on sale. Oh well.

    I will admit that I have not been following the “buy what you like” advice lately. All I have bought the last couple of years is some of the uncirculated gold that has not sold well (spouses, National Parks, and Boys Town).

    My logic is that I can go back later and buy the proofs for a small premium over spot someday, but a few of these uncirculated golds will be tough to find.

  10. CDC says

    Has anyone called Michael White to inquire about why sales figures haven’t been released yet? “Questions can be directed to Michael White, Office of Public Affairs, at (202) 354-7222.”

  11. So Krates says

    10 – ???
    ’11 – 25th Anny ASE 5 coin set
    ’12 – ??? —PROOF SETS (clad, silver & LE)
    ’13 – ???—–RP GOLD BUFF (kinda)
    ’14 – ??? —-JFK GOLD HALF (temporary)
    ’14 – Native American C&C set
    ’14 – $5 BHoF
    ’14 – $1 BHoF
    ’15 – APE
    ’15 – Truman C&C
    ’15 – Ike C&C
    ’16 – Silver HR Medal
    ’17 – ‘S’ Congratulations Set

  12. Old Big Bird says

    @CDC – I did call the customer service yesterday about the lack of release of sales number.
    In the past I placed a call to Michael White, Office of Public Affairs, at (202) 354-7222. and
    all I got was a secretary and left a message. I was asked what publication was I with, Needless to say
    I NEVER received a call back. But you can try it. I wonder what would happen if 50 people called his
    office about it?

  13. Old Big Bird says

    Now as far as the USM reporting sales numbers.
    Well they USM must be on spring break LOL.
    I did look it a few minutes ago and it seem to be a change in the web site
    when going into production and sales.


  14. sharks2th says

    @KCSO – Some of us have been around here since around 2007 or so. We used to post as “anonymous” until the site changed and let posters make up an ID to use on the site. I’m sure some of the real old timers remember the old system.

    The site has generally been very informative with all who share their knowledge and experience. Occasionally the trolls get the site off topic, but usually things eventually return to normalcy (like the spell earlier this year). When the problem children start their ranting I just stop reading for a while. There has been a bit better job of cutting off some of the negative off topic stuff than there used to be. The regulars here know who the problem children are and generally ignore them.

    I, like a lot of the others here, also collect some of the classic series and enjoy the occasional discussion of older series of the different denominations. Part of enjoying the hobby is sharing knowledge and learning new things from the other collectors. This site offers a great discussion forum you can “attend” when time permits.

    On a side note regarding the off-topic BBQ discussion, there is a convenience store at the top of the hill on the west side of I-81 exit 150 near Roanoke Va that has an unbelievable hickory smoked BBQ sandwich for 4 bucks if anyone is traveling through that area. I happened to stop there last year to get gas on my way to Florida for vacation and discovered this mouth watering sandwich. After I had gotten a few more hours down the road I wished I had bought a couple more to snack on my 16 hour drive.

  15. cagcrisp says

    @bg35765, “I will admit that I have not been following the “buy what you like” advice lately.”

    I’ve Never followed the buy what you like advice.

    I only buy for Investment purposes. IF I don’t think it has Long Term legs, I don’t Buy…

  16. A&L Futures says

    ’06 – anything w/ a TPG First Strike / Early Releases label
    ’07 –
    ’08 – Silver Eagle (Rev. of ’07)
    ’08 – Gold Eagle(s)
    ’08 – Platinum Eagles (Uncirculated & Proof)
    ’09 – UHR
    ’10 – ???
    ’11 – 25th Anny ASE 5 coin set
    ’12 – ??? —PROOF SETS (clad, silver & LE)
    ’13 – ???—–RP GOLD BUFF (kinda)
    ’14 – ??? —-JFK GOLD HALF (temporary)
    ’14 – Native American C&C set
    ’14 – $5 BHoF
    ’14 – $1 BHoF
    ’15 – APE
    ’15 – Truman C&C
    ’15 – Ike C&C
    ’16 – Silver HR Medal
    ’17 – ‘S’ Congratulations Set

  17. Xena says

    Received an email from GoldenEagle Coin about an hour ago:
    1/10th oz Proof American Gold Eagles are just $155. This includes any and all dates we have in stock. Each coin comes shipped in its original Mint display case, complete with Certificate of Authenticity.

    Seems like a good deal, although cag and others would know much better than I would.

  18. A&L Futures says

    Oops, I forgot a couple…

    ’06 – anything w/ a TPG First Strike / Early Releases label (the birth of the label wars)
    ’07 – “frosted” FREEDOM Platinum Eagle
    ’08 – Silver Eagle (Rev. of ’07)
    ’08 – fractional “W” Gold Eagles
    ’08 – fractional “W” Gold Buffalos
    ’08 – Platinum Eagles (Uncirculated & Proof)
    ’09 – UHR
    ’10 – ???
    ’11 – 25th Anny ASE 5 coin set
    ’12 – ??? —PROOF SETS (clad, silver & LE)
    ’13 – ???—–RP GOLD BUFF (kinda)
    ’14 – ??? —-JFK GOLD HALF (temporary)
    ’14 – Native American C&C set
    ’14 – $5 BHoF
    ’14 – $1 BHoF
    ’15 – APE
    ’15 – Truman C&C
    ’15 – Ike C&C
    ’16 – Silver HR Medal
    ’17 – ‘S’ Congratulations Set

  19. cagcrisp says

    Need some help here –

    Can you think of mint offerings that had a considerable run up after release?

    ANY Gold out of Carson City
    ANY Gold out of Charlotte
    ANY Gold out of Dahlonega
    A Gold $4 Stella…

  20. LurkingTroll says

    Just for jollies – tried the the nag pop-up (AKA Chat box) on USM web site to inquire about status of last week’s Sales Report…
    After a reply to allow a few minutes to research answer, received typical CS reply: sorry for the inconvenience but cannot help you with that issue at this time…
    No surprise here.

  21. Mint News Blog says

    Has anyone seen the Mint’s new “News” page? And if so, were you able to find where the sales reports are?

  22. earthling says

    I think the HR Gold was/is/will continue to be a complete failure – which means a surge at the end of sales from the low mintage hounds. I personally want no parts of the coin. Could care less. So why they want to hide the poor sales numbers?

    I think with Moonlight Mint and Grove Minting I’ve got the Medalic Issues covered , so no interest in 225th US mint Medals either.

    With my subpar flip on the Congrats Sets, I think I’m about done with everything from the US Mint.

  23. cagcrisp says

    @MNB, I can find the Sales numbers under the “news” section.

    Problem is…

    …They are still 04/02/17 numbers…

  24. sharks2th says

    @MNB – The sales reports are on the “About” page. Go to the About page. It is not shown as a link like It used to be shown. Once on the About page hit the “Menu” drop down list and it is shown there. They still don’t have the 4/12 report. I think the person responsible is probably on vacation this week. This is the Easter/Spring Break week for many of the DC area schools.

  25. joe#2 says

    IMO, The U.S. Mint really doesn’t care about there sales numbers. They figure, ” Well, If we sell 20-25k of them”, The rest we sell is gravy.

  26. Old Big Bird says

    @shark2th – That is the new web-site page I mentioned at 10:41am and yes MNB it still only shows 04/02/17 sales numbers. Sad sad sad. Has anyone tried to call their Michael White, Office of Public Affairs, at (202) 354-7222 and get the run around?

  27. Barry says

    @ Xena-imo the price on that proof 1/10 oz. AGE is a good price imo as you get the OGP and certificate. The price you mentioned would be more in line with the bullion AGE. If you get free shipping and can buy on a cc all the better. Cheers.

  28. Erik H says

    I found my first 2017 P cent today and it came with a “red” 1963 cent too. Still looking for a roll of 2017 P cents, hopefully soon.

  29. gatortreke says

    KCSO – to add to your run up list:

    2012 – Acadia NP 5 oz P (NQ2)
    2012 – Hawai’i Volcanoes NP 5 oz P (NQ3)
    2013 – Theodore Roosevelt C&C (TR0) (very quietly without all the hype like the 2015 sets)

  30. says

    Hey gang, just wondering your thoughts. Work has been down lately and I haven’t been in a very jovial coin-buying mode. Translation: I completely missed out on the 2017-S ASE. I see it will also be offered in the LESPS sometime this year. Do you think it will be worth the price to get the LESPS just for the 2017-S ASE? Seems like prices for the 2017-S ASE have gone through the roof.

    Also in your experience do you think this will be another 20 minute sellout farce for the LESPS? And when is this typically released during the year?

    Thanks for thoughts. I love learning from you guys.


  31. says

    Mike, good question, though one best asked in November or December prior to when the LESPS usually comes out, hard to answer until we know:

    1. Product limit
    2. Price point
    3. Any other surprises with it?

    My first inclination is to say, No;
    yet we do not know 1-3 above.

    Consider this, one would be foolish to break open a LESPS to rob the ASE and throw it in a capsule for a collection; Graders will be on it hot to have the set graded.

    My gut tells me things (the environment surrounding the release) will be different; I question whether the ASE S will still have steam by then to go the distance, TWT.

    The dynamics of the S ASE could alter considerably in a month or two, again TWT.

    I’d watch auctions closely come May.

    And ask again prior to the LESPS release , if still interested

  32. says

    One other thought, if I was holding extra Congrats sets to offload, I’d be getting a little nervous about now,

    Auctions are driving to up to $140 to $157.

    These moderns rarely sustain 3x over initial release price for very long, though sometimes they surprise ya.

    Within 3 weeks all of the dealers Slabbed coins will be hitting eBay, that’ll change the current dynamics.

    I really wish we knew that sales number for this Congrats set, that would reveal A LOT was to what to expect and where this thing is headed.

    900 orders just isn’t that many to consume 75,000??? We’ll see next week I guess

  33. says

    Thanks guys for the ‘run up’ coin list,
    I’ll update tomorrow, you probably see where I’m headed with it already

  34. Erik H says

    KCSO, the 2010 ATBs (Bullion & P) all commanded strong premiums right out of the gate. I flipped all mine so I don’t know (care) what they are worth today. I also did pretty good with the March of Dimes set. I kept one set plus a few dimes.

  35. Throckmorton says

    I only buy for Investment purposes. IF I don’t think it has Long Term legs, I don’t Buy…

    Some of us shouldn’t be buying green bananas but I do anyway.

  36. cagcrisp says

    Heading out to see the Arkansas Derby. I’m expecting between 65-70,000 people.

    Hoping to find another American Pharoah. Classic Empire , like Pharoah, is a son of Pioneerof the Nile( my Derby horse the year Mind that Bird won).

    Classic Empire has all the physical talents to Win the Arkansas Derby if he brings his A Game. He Is also a Mental basket case. Refusing to work, throwing jockey out of the gate and just general quirkiness.

    He has trained well in front of a few hundred or so that have watched him train since he got here Wednesday. Will see how he performs in front of Thousands of screaming people.

    If every horse comes out of the race in good order, there Should be 3 Arkansas Derby horses that will be seen in 3 weeks at The Kentucky Derby…

  37. Mint News Blog says

    I don’t bet on the ponies anymore, but my hubs is looking at Silver Dust — he figures he’ll go forward off the Rebel.

  38. xmarine1970 says

    Got up early this morning and on a hunch signed into the US Mint website. At 7:30 was able to place an order for 50 of the 2017 Congratulations Sets. Just got off the phone with them and order was confirmed and credit card has been charged. (Tried to place a second order at 7:31 showed unavailable)

  39. Brad says


    Actually, it’s extremely possible that a ballpark of 900 orders could have consumed the entire maximum mintage for the 2017 Congratulations Set. The Mint allows up to 100 of the same item number per order (it used to be 99). So, technically only 750 orders could have taken them all. We know there were many orders placed for lesser quantities of course, but if a large number of the 100 orders got through first, then viola!

  40. sharks2th says

    Brad, you make an excellent point. Since this item would probably not be eligible for bulk purchases, the big boys were limited to a de facto limit of 100 per order. This would mean they would have to have their minions all trying to buy their limits at the same time as the rest of us. This would explain why the HSN guy only got a few hundred based on what some others have said here.

    If say 700 dealers and their agents got 100 each (70k), that would average the other 200 orders to around 25 per order (5k). This would account for some orders larger than 25 and some smaller collector orders of a few per order. Another permutation could have been 600@100, 100@75, 100@50 and 100@25 per order to reach 75k. This would not account for any regular collector orders of a few per order. The math seems indicate there were a high number of 100 coin orders if no bulk purchases were permitted.

    Maybe with the de facto limit of 100 per order the Mint determined they didn’t need a lower HHL. This might explain some of the Mint’s illogical logic. We also don’t know for sure how many were available at each of the mint’s stores which could account for a few hundred or more additional orders not showing up in the internet order numbers.

  41. Bigguy says

    I wish the mint would stop the medal thing,sorry I am a coin guy. These are not coins to me,everybody has their own thing that keeps them going,for me it old coins

  42. Yes, But...You Can't Take It With You says

    Happy Easter, everyone!

    My wish for this Easter is that So Krates would go see the movie “The Case For Christ” and report back to us with a review. Since the guy that the movie is about was a skeptic this should be right up SK’s alley. “Just the facts, please.” 🙂

    To bring it back to numismatics: When Jesus held a Roman coin he said “Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar’s and unto God the things that are God’s.”

  43. earthling says

    Well looks like Dave Harper of Numismatic News has come through with numbers on sales of that monumental Gold thingamajig.

    ” After the first 24 hours had elapsed following the April 6 sales date, the Mint had sold 14,285 pieces. This was not strong.

    Naturally, I wondered if the now common sales pattern where sales rates plummet after the first day would occur.

    The normal weekly bunch of statistics would add another two days of information to the beginning total. It is normally posted by the Mint at the close of business on the East Coast on Tuesdays.

    Wednesday morning it was not there. I was antsy. I have to get the information prepared on that day for Numismatic News. I emailed Mike White, who is the crackerjack spokesman for the Mint.

    He checked for me and responded so fast that his answer arrived almost before I had asked the question.

    “Due to some web/software situation, the weekly sales report was not published yesterday and will not be published until next Tuesday,” he wrote me.

    He knew I would be disappointed at that information so he helpfully provided further information that sales of the 2017 $100 gold piece stood at 16,746. “

  44. earthling says

    Sales on 4/6/17 – 14,285

    4/9/17 – 16,746

    Sales increase 2,461 through 4/9/17 ( Sunday )

  45. cagcrisp says

    As Expected, KCSO is the Winner of the Launch Week Sales for the 2017 HR IF earthing’s numbers are Correct.

    KCSO Guesstimate was 16,750…And…

    …The Launch week sales (according to earthling’s post) were 16,746.

    Can’t get much closer than that…

  46. earthling says

    Oops looks like the 2nd sales figure given was for Wednesday 4-12-17 , not Sunday 4-9-17.

    So from the opening bell , sales increased 2,461 through 4-12-17. About as slow as everyone ecpected. Where are the P.C. Buyers when the Mint needs them?


    asleep at the wheel……….

  47. cagcrisp says

    Here’s My Guesstimate for sales numbers for 04/16/17: 17,190

    17,190-16,750 = 440 for a week

    I would guess 200+ /week for a period

    Then 100+/week for a period

    …And then… <100/week until Pull Sign is Hung Up

    Even IF the Mint keeps the 2017 HR around for 2 years the Mint will NEVER sell as many 2017 HR as the did in the first 75 Minutes of the 2015 HR

    75 Minutes for a Somewhat controversial 2015 HR = ~ 30,000
    2 years sales for a Highly controversial 2017 HR = 27,000 (or whatever number the Mint chooses until it Slowly Dies on the Vine)…

  48. earthling says

    Now all we have to wonder about is when will Sales get cut off? And how many will sell by then?

    Will we be engaged in foreign adventures by then? Will Gold be at $5,000 or maybe even higher?

  49. says

    Thanks Earthling, good catch!

    Yeah, he meant the 16th, & and price went up another $50 that day.

    Joe M – sorry Mate, please upload your virtual HR Liberty back into the cloud, 😉

  50. says

    Cag – “75 Minutes for a Somewhat controversial 2015 HR = ~ 30,000
    2 years sales for a Highly controversial 2017 HR = 27,000 (or whatever number the Mint chooses until it Slowly Dies on the Vine)…”

    Sounds like Gold Kennedy all over again.., just a lot lower on the sales

  51. Erik H says

    Subtract one 2017 HR Liberty off the weekly total. The design looked great in person however the flaws on the coin (they could be seen with the naked eye) were to many to justify keeping with a $400 premium. I will try again with the silver version later. At least when the silver version comes out I can buy several to cherry pick the best ones to keep.

  52. says

    Erik –

    Can you share the flaws that you saw?

    I’ve been equally concerned with the proof, I had to return many gold JFK’s due to visible flaws until I found a keeper. Disappointed to hear

  53. cagcrisp says

    There will be a Ton of returns from the Big Boys for the 2017 HR when they can’t get a 70…

  54. earthling says

    ” There will be a Ton of returns from the Big Boys for the 2017 HR when they can’t get a 70… ”

    And when they can’t even sell 70’s… what then?

    Well, I suppose the price will come down….. if they have too many. If not too many 70’s then of course they will just hold until some PT Barnum fan comes along.

  55. Erik H says

    KCSO, The first and most obvious was was a small hole on the “collar bone” of Liberty. I don’t know if it was a metal flow problem or of some debris was on the die (not an expert). Also the stars had light hair line scratches on them. I almost did notice them at first but as I rotated it in the light they appeared. They didn’t seem like die polish marks, it seemed like “slider” type marks. My coin was in the capsule but out of the hole so it was rattling in the presentation box. Reverse was flawless and no finning on the rim like the 2015 HRs.

    I do like the coin, I believe it will be a classic in the “distant” future, just not in the next 5, 10 or even 20 years. I think the 4 different finishes on the silver will be cool (I wish they were coins and not medals). I will probably have to buy 5 sets to find one or two nice sets.

  56. Joe M. says

    @ KCSO
    Ok, there’s the gold coin back in the cloud.

  57. So Krates says

    @ Yes But…Thanks for the suggestion but it really doesn’t arouse my curiosity. I think you should review the movie if you’d like, then I will read your comments. Better yet, please make your own scientific case for Jesus. Please don’t forget to include biological details about his supernatural contraception and an explanation of the interactions of the physical systems involved in transubstantiation. Then you can explain how dinosaurs and humans hung out together in Noah’s Ark 😉

    I’m actually much more interested in the book Xena mentioned, Christianity: The First Three Thousand Years . I’ve heard it is a comprehensive work that is worthwhile. A serious academic work can impart some understanding, while silly projects like O’Reilly’s book, Killing Jesus , Mel Gibson’s Passion… , and this one you mentioned seem more like entertainment.

  58. says

    Thanks Erik for the heads-up, that is very disappointing to hear.

    So frustrating to spend that much and then have to return it.

    I ordered mine a week ago Friday, and it has yet to ship, so I called and they basically said to sit tight, they have have a week or two to process orders.

    Not too many of us are having feel good experiences as of late.

  59. Erik H says

    This was the first high dollar coin that I have returned with the mint’s new contractor (I was hesitant after past experiences with small dollar coins taking weeks to having my money refunded to me). In the past I just sell unsatisfactory coins to a local dealer at cost then cherry pick a “69” from a dealer. I didn’t think I could find a dealer that would buy this coin for much more than spot at this time which us why I decided return it. Last year I bought two proof platinum coins and both were rejects. I took a loss selling one and replaced it with a nice PCGS PR69.

  60. says

    2017 Congratulations set:
    My frustration with the U.S.Mints sale is significant.
    I can not decide if the mint is monumentally: incompetent or corrupt or both.
    As a slight diversion for a hobby while predisposed to the thought ‘paper money’ will loose purchasing power & something to share with my Grandson since 1986 I have collected American Silver Eagles.
    In my opinion the recent sale of the 2017 Congratulation set has all the attributes of a con. The set up being a very limited production of a coin…of which ‘no house hold limit’ was established.
    If the hobby wants to continue with any form of enthusiasm situations such as this must be looked at.
    For me, I feel like a sucker because of not being ‘in on the scam’ to sequester a very large portion of a commodity into the control of a few for a subsequent significant price gouging!
    I should think a I.G. investigation is merited. I suspect someones relative has just made some $ for orchestrating the recent sale.
    As others have stated within this blog I am seriously considering just staying with pre-1933 gold coins. Besides, I do not like that ‘trained monkey’ feeling -awaiting by a pre-set computer or partially dialed telephone number to purchase something close to 12 noon E.T. that, if successful, arrives in difficult to store unnecessarily bulky packaging.
    Again, IMHO, the mint needs to look at its whole commercial profile & the above described scenario. At some point there will be someone to rat for the spectrum of reasons.

    Semper Fi

  61. joe#2 says

    A real pity that our Mint is putting out highly priced premium gold defects with high mintage. New leadership at the Mint is needed ASAP.

  62. earthling says

    I’ve always believed money talks and bullmess walks. If the Mint prescreened their goods and shipped the best to their best customers , and the rest to their secondary customers… things would be… who knows.

    You want a 70? A lot of folks say buy from a Dealer, don’t waste your time trying to make your own.

    😕 hmmmmm……..

  63. Yes, But...You Can't Take It With You says

    So Krates: I did see the movie “The Case For Christ” and I liked it. Admittedly, I was being slightly provocative by calling you out as one who should review it. Honestly, though, it seems that you would be intrigued by the story. It is not a documentary. Rather, it is a dramatization of a modern hard-core skeptic’s journey from animosity toward religion to Christian faith. My review would not be nearly as exciting – I am not a skeptic.

    As for Mel Gibson’s “The Passion”: I don’t understand why you would label it as “silly”. Have you seen it? The historical proof for Jesus being tortured and crucified is solid. The Passion is a dramatic unfolding of these events, albeit infused with elements of His teaching and faith in His Deity. Of course, there is that last 60 seconds of the movie during which the Resurrection is portrayed.

    As for the other things you mentioned: Although I don’t subscribe to a belief in everything you asked about, I would agree with the challenge put to the main character in The Case For Christ – the Resurrection is the “jugular” issue. If Jesus rose from the dead then clearly anything else is possible. If not – carry on, all the rest is, to use your word, “silly”.

    At any rate, enjoy your day, whatever it is that you do on Easter Sunday!

  64. Xena says

    Happy Easter everyone.

    So Krates – I agree with you, skip the pop culture movies. The book I mentioned is a well researched history book. He jumps around a lot, so if you like a linear history lesson, this is not that book. It’s about Christianity, but I wouldn’t call it pro Christian. Apparently we didn’t need other faiths, spent a lot of effort killing each other. Leaves me a bit cynical at times. Thought provoking about many things including the separation (or not) of church and state. There’s a BBC DVD serious also. If I remember correctly, the author is not a Christian, although his father is a priest (he mentions it in the last video).

    In God We Trust.

  65. Erik H says

    Earthling, I don’t buy “70” unless it’s a super deal. I prefer cherry picked “69”. I really prefer mint fresh OGP but it seems like I keep getting duds. When I buy from the mint I don’t use magnification when deciding if I will keep a coin. However when it comes to buying slabs “buy the coin, not the holder” is the only way to go. There are lots over under graded modern’s just like there are lots of 70s that should be 69s.

  66. jhawk92 says


    Congrats on getting an order in for the Congratulations Set. My order for 2 is still showing Backorder and no CC ping. Maybe it’s worth calling the mint and seeing when they plan to send my two sets…

    @ A&L-

    I’m on the low end of Cat IV.

  67. David says

    I find that a lot of the mints products are overpriced for what you get. Just take a look at proof and mint sets. Totally not worth what you pay.

  68. Scott says

    @ Erik H, you are 100% right on your last comment IMHO. 70s aren’t what they used to be.

  69. Old Big Bird says

    What are the odds that the USM will finally release sales numbers this week on Tuesday by 5pm?

  70. earthling says

    Be a Dealer. Submit a large lot of Coins. Pay your money. Get 70’s. Sell to all the smart cookies that want the best.


  71. earthling says

    I have a confession – I prefer BU Bullion ASE’s raw in a Mint issue tube of 20 , over a slabbed PF70 with autograph or any special labeling.

    Guess I’m not one of those smart cookie collectors? Oh well, to me an ounce of Silver is an ounce of Silver. Do bullion buyers think like that? My guess is that a slabbed Piece of bullion represents more work , so less money that can be paid out.

  72. says

    I like holding coins. I like them in my hand. I like to turn them over and feel them and to me that’s the joy of this hobby. When a coin is in a holder, it’s like it’s in prison. Or in a museum. Yeah, I can enjoy looking at it, but the sense of ownership is removed. I kinda feel like someone else has dibs on it because it has so much packaging and advertising for the grading company.

    I know graded coins are a smarter investment, but I generally choose to get my coins raw from the mint, to heck with the grading. Sometimes it doesn’t work out, but most times I’m pleased.

  73. says

    I guess for me it all started back when my dad used to slip me a silver quarter. Or a mercury dime. The thrill of seeing those “old” coins was just wonderful! Learning the story of how “pre 1964” coins were silver; carefully sifting change – and sometimes finding the odd silver quarter! – was just awesome! So I guess that’s why this whole grading/slabbing thing is off-putting to me. You can’t roll a slabbed coin.

  74. Donald says

    Yeah Mike, the crazy thing is that collectors who buy such items as bullion American Silver Eagles in the Mint tubes typically never actually see these coins, as they usually remain unopened sight unseen. Many collectors have also bought rolls of state quarters and ATB quarters, only to be able to lay eyes on either the obverse or reverse side of the bookend coins. But, that’s the nature of the hobby.

  75. earthling says

    Ahhh yes State Quarters. I got lots of State Quarters all safely Rolled and Bagged still in the Mint issued sealed boxes. Now what on Earth can I do with those silly things? Well I suppose I’ll slowly break em out and spend them. I used to buy $1 Coins from the Mint just to spend them. I already have the Quarters so I’ll just spend those instead. Handing out Minty fresh State Quarters ought to be just as much fun as putting Golden Dollars into Store Peoples hands. Well, almost.

  76. Old Big Bird says

    Cagrisp – What do you think, do we finally get sales number from the USM tomorrow.
    Oh just for laughs I emailed the USM of course not response yet LOL.

  77. cagcrisp says

    @Old Big Bird, Yes I think we will get numbers Tomorrow. Seems like there is a Lot of momentum in that direction…

  78. ips_stuff says

    anyone with “back ordered” order status for 2017 congratulations set, see any movement?

    I know that calling the customer service representative at the us mint is a complete waste of time.

    Just curious if anyone’s order has moved at all.

  79. cagcrisp says

    The Supreme Court has Ruled : Petition Denied

    Roy Langbord, et al., Petitioners
    Department of the Treasury, et al.
    Docketed: November 4, 2016
    Lower Ct: United States Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit
    Case Nos.: (12-4574)
    Decision Date: August 1, 2016

    ~~~Date~~~ ~~~~~~~Proceedings and Orders~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Oct 28 2016 Petition for a writ of certiorari filed. (Response due December 5, 2016)
    Nov 30 2016 Waiver of right of respondent Department of the Treasury, et al. to respond filed.
    Dec 14 2016 DISTRIBUTED for Conference of January 6, 2017.
    Jan 6 2017 Response Requested . (Due February 6, 2017)
    Feb 2 2017 Order extending time to file response to petition to and including March 8, 2017.
    Mar 8 2017 Brief of respondents Department of the Treasury, et al. in opposition filed.
    Mar 20 2017 Reply of petitioner Roy Langbord, et al. filed.
    Mar 22 2017 DISTRIBUTED for Conference of April 13, 2017.
    Apr 17 2017 Petition DENIED. Justice Gorsuch took no part in the consideration or decision of this petition.

  80. MarkInFlorida says

    You’re right earthling, when the financial bubble finally pops and silver is $100 or $200 and ounce, you won’t get much more for a slabbed Proof 70 silver eagle than you will for a plain bullion one.

  81. says

    @ ips_stuff No movement on my back order. I do recall seeing when I placed my order a back order date sometime in May. Everything happened so fast that I did not get a chance to see the complete back order date.

  82. ike says

    No movement on my congrats set. Still backordered. I did receive 1 with several other items on the same order. I could not find any flaws with it.

  83. ike says

    It also did not have a back order until 2 or 3 days later. It said processing & surprised me when the status changed to back ordered

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