Examining Sales of 2012-2013 Presidential and Native American Dollars

roseveltIn late 2011, the Treasury Department announced that the production of Presidential Dollars for circulation would be suspended. This decision followed the build up of a surplus of more than 1.4 billion dollar coins held in storage, which prompted media scrutiny of the program and six separate bills introduced in Congress which sought to limit, modify, or abolish the program altogether.

Starting in 2012, the new releases of the Presidential Dollar program were no longer distributed through the channels of circulation, but were only available within products sold by the United States Mint. To coincide with the change, the product offerings for circulating $1 coins were revamped to include more bulk options and new lower pricing was established.

Sales figures for circulating quality Presidential Dollar products were strong following the change. The release featuring Chester Arthur recorded initial sales which were more than triple the initial level for the previous release of the series. Within two weeks, sales had accounted for more than 6 million of the $1 coins, which exceeded the US Mint’s anticipated demand and initial production level. As of the most recent sales report, Chester Arthur Dollar sales have now swelled to more than 8.7 million and counting.

The table below shows the most recent sales figures for each of the circulating quality 2012-2013 Presidential Dollar products and a calculation of the total number of coins sold.

2012 CHESTER ARTHUR Units Coins
$25-roll (P) 57,542 1,438,550
$25-roll (D) 51,575 1,289,375
$250-box (P) 11,949 2,987,250
$250-box (D) 6,425 1,606,250
$500-box (P) 1,158 579,000
$500-box (D) 1,158 579,000
$100-bag (P) 1,292 129,200
$100-bag (D) 1,093 109,300
$25-roll (P) 54,836 1,370,900
$25-roll (D) 51,726 1,293,150
$250-box (P) 10,799 2,699,750
$250-box (D) 6,156 1,539,000
$500-box (P) 991 495,500
$500-box (D) 701 350,500
$100-bag (P) 1,397 139,700
$100-bag (D) 1,093 109,300
$25-roll (P) 53,842 1,346,050
$25-roll (D) 48,523 1,213,075
$250-box (P) 9,937 2,484,250
$250-box (D) 4,986 1,246,500
$500-box (P) 849 424,500
$500-box (D) 855 427,500
$100-bag (P) 1,089 108,900
$100-bag (D) 997 99,700
$25-roll (P) 51,517 1,287,925
$25-roll (D) 44,772 1,119,300
$250-box (P) 9,534 2,383,500
$250-box (D) 4,995 1,248,750
$500-box (P) 715 357,500
$500-box (D) 733 366,500
$100-bag (P) 1,076 107,600
$100-bag (D) 922 92,200
$25-roll (P) 48,679 1,216,975
$25-roll (D) 42,048 1,051,200
$250-box (P) 9,019 2,254,750
$250-box (D) 4,238 1,059,500
$500-box (P) 595 297,500
$500-box (D) 579 289,500
$100-bag (P) 1,320 132,000
$100-bag (D) 1,283 128,300
$25-roll (P) 47,688 1,192,200
$25-roll (D) 42,413 1,060,325
$250-box (P) 9,463 2,365,750
$250-box (D) 4,264 1,066,000
$500-box (P) 627 313,500
$500-box (D) 587 293,500
$100-bag (P) 1,538 153,800
$100-bag (D) 1,486 148,600
$25-roll (P) 39,945 998,625
$25-roll (D) 35,563 889,075
$250-box (P) 6,688 1,672,000
$250-box (D) 3,063 765,750
$500-box (P) 450 225,000
$500-box (D) 450 225,000
$100-bag (P) 989 98,900
$100-bag (D) 861 86,100

Although part of it has to do with the duration of each sales period, there has seemingly been a declining trend in sales for the circulating quality Presidential Dollars since the switch in the status of the program. With the exception of the Theodore Roosevelt Dollars, each subsequent release shows lower sales than the previous release.

This actually mirrors the trend in mintage levels, which had occurred when the coins were produced for circulation from 2007 to 2011. The first issues of the series saw production in the hundreds of millions, which dissipated as the series continued, eventually settling around the mid-70 million range for most releases, with the exception of a jump in production for the Abraham Lincoln issue due to his popularity.

As the Presidential Dollar Program enters its final years, I think there may be some continued moderation in demand until a base level is reached. Then, demand and sales may jump as the more familiar recent Presidents are honored.

na-dollarThe 2012-2013 Native American Dollar sales levels are also interesting to examine. When the production of Presidential Dollars for circulation was suspended, Native American Dollar production was also sharply curtailed. By law, the production for this series is supposed to represent at least 20% of annual production for all $1 coins. (The US Mint has not achieved this requirement in recent years.).

Sales levels for the Native American Dollars have been far below the levels of the Presidential Dollars. The 2012-dated products have all sold out at the US Mint. The 2013-dated products continue to remain available. The table below shows the last reported sales figures and a calculation of the total coins included.

$25-roll (P) 27,942 698,550
$25-roll (D) 27,975 699,375
$250-box (P) 2,588 647,000
$250-box (D) 2,583 645,750
$500-box (P) 473 236,500
$500-box (D) 451 225,500
$100-bag (P) 1,813 181,300
$100-bag (D) 1,722 172,200
$25-roll (P) 17,796 444,900
$25-roll (D) 17,099 427,475
$250-box (P) 1,822 455,500
$250-box (D) 1,801 450,250
$500-box (P) 274 137,000
$500-box (D) 255 127,500
$100-bag (P) 1,194 119,400
$100-bag (D) 1,162 116,200

While collector attention seems to have been focused primarily on the Presidential Dollars, the Native American Dollars may present an opportunity. The series offers much greater variety in terms of design and mintage levels seem like they will be half or less. Since the 2012-dated rolls are no longer available from the US Mint, they seem to trade for a healthy premium on the secondary market.

For the 2013 Native American Dollars, the US Mint has indicated production to date of 1.82 million coins each at the Philadelphia and Denver Mints. It is always possible that additional production may occur prior to the end of the year, but if the figures hold, they would be lower than the prior year. If the series is considered a continuation of the Sacagawea Dollar series, this would represent a tie for the lowest mintage with the 2008-P and 2008-D issues, which seem to sell for two to three times face value.

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  1. Brad says

    If you have the way to do it, these dollar coins can be pretty lucrative to re-sell. You buy them for a little over a buck each, and sell them for $2 each. When you do that in enough bulk, it can really add up.

    From the new stats to be published tomorrow, it appears 595 additional Proof Buffalo gold coins sold this week, and still no sellout. So, it looks like a few thousand more will be struck.

    The number this week for the WP set is 236,843. So, I guess the Mint is still fulfilling orders. It may be another “work in progress” like last week’s number must have been.

  2. KEITHSTER says

    It’s been said that all the WP’s have been shipped so any returns and that number should get sweeter so go ahead send them back:) Except for the one’s in the slab’s with the spot’s I don’t know if you can send them back kin ya? Should try to get a few Native’s before the free shipping ends! Good luck to us all:>

  3. IPS_STUFF says

    @im just a bill ???

    Not sure of your math on double or triple the S mint quarters.
    If you account for the fact the there is a P & D mint sacagawa… there is a mintage of 1.8 million

    and I believe (2012) S mint quarters is 1.6 million

  4. KEITHSTER says

    I just happen to like the wolf turkey and turtle on a USA $ coin none of those on any of the quarters yet! And I’ll bet down the road 1 of the non-circ. unc Native $ will still be worth 4 of the non-circ. unc. S quarters? As for mintage if you count the P&D quarters you know there is over a billion of those this year 3 million something isn’t that bad.Also have plenty of the S’s how many are without spots is the big? Hav’nt seen any spots on the natives anybody? Any way these one’s are just for fun anyway:) Good luck to each and all:>

  5. VA Bob says

    One of the big problems with this coins are the few that do circulate look terrible. The ‘golden’ color just doesn’t hold up well. Sure they are nice in a proof or mint state. The best advertisement a clad coin can get is to circulate. These look ugly in short order. Personally, I would have rather seen these at 95% copper (it’s most of there composition anyway). Copper holds up well, just compare the zinc cents to pre-1982 cents. I have been enjoying the Native American designs. It’s a shame more people don’t get to enjoy them.

  6. Jerry Diekmann says

    The reason that the President dollars have declined in mintages is that, after #7 (Jackson) the ret of the 19th century with two exceptions (#11 – Polk & #16 – Lincoln) the presidents were either mediocre, or more likely, losers who never should have been president. As for the ugly color of the dollars after they have been in circulation a short time, that is due to including manganese in the coin alloy. Manganese is a terrible element to put in coinage, as evidenced by the war nickels which developed a sickly color over time. You would have thought the Mint would have learned from that mistake, but the Mint never seems to learn or remember anything. Next, we’ll be back to steel cents like in 1943.

  7. gatortreke says

    I too like the variety of the Native American designs, they are much more artistic than the Presidential series. I’ve heard the 2013 design referred to as the “Howlin’ Turtle” design. Seems to fit but I still like it.

  8. someone says


    Same here. The NA $1 coins are indeed very artistic. Of course, the original reverse design (2000-2008) is very good as well.

  9. VARich says

    Brad – thanks for the heads-up! Mint XLS still showing 236 – perhaps we’ll see an ‘unofficial’ prelim sales # for the WP set later today. At 236, the set should do well in the long term.

    On the Buff, where VABB has cited reasoning for other sets being delayed for packaging, I’m of the growing opinion as to how where seeing the day for day slip for the proof more indicative of packaging issues as well. We know that regardless of when you placed an order over the past two weeks, the ship date is the same; and we know the anticipated ship date (one in red font) is when the product leaves for the distro site in Indy.., which keeps slipping.

    So it’s really hard to deduct as this point how many may have been minted – they’ve accepted orders for over 15.2k as you pointed out earlier. Could be 18k? 20k?.., though just speculating, they have probably all been minted at this point.

    I’m hoping for a sell out soon, or a big bump in Ag (though not helpful to our FS brethren).., otherwise, I’m feeling that this could be a long wait…, thoughts anyone?

  10. GMS says

    The decreased mintage has nothing to do with who’s image is on the dollar Jerry, it’s more likely due to the fact that the mint stopped distributing dollar coins to the banks in 2011. therefore the only ones issued are the ones people like us order from the mint. In addition, I’ll bet most people couldn’t even name half the Presidents you describe as mediocre or losers, much less tell you what kind of administration they oversaw.

  11. VARich says

    GMS – Interesting points – saw this over the weekend; you may want to raise ‘most’ to ‘vast majority’ on your bet…, sad, so very sad.

    “A 2010 survey found that more than 25% of Americans didn’t know that we had gained our independence from Britain. China, Japan and France were all given as incorrect answers. And the results were even worse in a study by the U.S. Mint, which found that only 7% percent of Americans could name the first four U.S.”


  12. fmtransmitter says

    Speaking of copper, I have bought some very beautiful rounds in the past. Copper has only increased in value and I have long thought of copper as the new silver long. In Michael’s recent email with Coin News, the Mulligan Mint has a nice deal on 500 Ounces of rounds despite their recent filing for bankruptcy for missing silver. If I can scrape up the funds and at $300 shipped, these rounds consistently sell for more than $.50 each on the bay.


  13. KEITHSTER says

    Sorry but I think this color changing thing might be the saving grace for these things? With 7 or 8 mill. each were going to need a lot of them to go ugly to make the nice one’s anything. Have one in a proof set that is a brillant orange seems a speck of the insert that is orange is touching the coin and has turned the whole coin a lovely orange while the others are still golden.So I think over the years it will be intresting to see how many colors and combo’s we cane get out of these baby’s? Keep um tight:) Good luck ya all:>

  14. says

    A very interesting post. I’d noticed the numbers had been trending gradually downward but it really seems like sales fell of a cliff for poor Taft. I am not sure I agree the sales of these coins will spike when we start to get to the modern presidents. I was really expecting a big surge for the Teddy Roosevelt coins, given Roosevelt’s popularity, but it did not materialize.

    I do think it’s possible we might see a surge in sales for some of the first spouses though, given how terrible the numbers are for them. Jackie Kennedy in particular strikes me as having the potential to be popular.

    The thoughts on the Native American dollars are interesting. I hadn’t really considered them as having premium potential with their falling mintages.

  15. Larry says

    So my RP buff is on its way, but the mint has made it hard for me to get it. According to UPS, I must be home to sigh for it. Sigh. In the past I was able to have it sent to the local UPS place so I could pick it up. Not this time. According to UPS there is no option, I have to be home and sign for it. So I guess I have to take some time off from work. Oh well….

  16. Dan in Fla says

    Larry- If it helps the UPS guy that comes here always comes after 5 PM. Usually later in the evening 6-7 pm.

  17. thePhelps says

    Dan in Fla… the ship from China has to make it back and load up…after having dropped off the last of the WP packaging…

  18. Jon in CT says

    Off Topic. It appears, according to the entry at https://www.fpds.gov/common/jsp/LaunchWebPage.jsp?command=execute&requestid=43792770&version=1.4, that the Mint has selected a vendor for its new numismatic customer fulfillment system. According to that entry this initial contract was signed with Priority Fulfillment Systems, Inc. (AKA PFSweb), runs until April 2014 and covers: “ORDER MANAGEMENT SYSTEM RETAIL SAILS END TO END SOLUTION – Design and Discovery Phases.” The Mint’s “Go-Live” requirement for this system is Oct 1, 2014.

    Kind of surprising neither the Mint nor PFSweb has issued a press release about this yet. I think it’s a big deal.

  19. GMS says

    Back on the topic of the Dollar coin, it wouldn’t surprise me if there is one more big push to get rid of the paper dollar once we approach the end of the series. If the mint properly markets the release of the final Presidents, that even the most out of touch citizen should recognize, it may be enough to allow them to utilize the billions they will have sitting in vaults at the FED by then.

  20. Val says

    I agree with GMS re Dollar coins. The Treasury wants to them in circulation and since some time has gone by since the last effort, it’s probably time for a new push by the Treasury.

  21. GMS says

    I think Ford will be the last one unless the legislation is amended to include Reagan as for the Native American series who knows. Im sure someone will correct me if my memory is failing.

  22. Smiledon says

    @ GMS,
    I think Regan will be included already.
    The question would be if President H. Bush passes, would he get a coin.

  23. GMS says

    I think they are suppose to have been dead for at least 5 years to be considered and I think the legislation would have to be amended based on when it was enacted to include Reagan. I’m sure someone has the original bill or has a link to it.

  24. Jon in CT says

    Off Topic. According to the entry at https://www.fpds.gov/ezsearch/fpdsportal?indexName=awardfull&templateName=1.4.4&s=FPDSNG.COM&q=CONTRACTING_AGENCY_NAME%3A%22UNITED+STATES+MINT%22%20%20PIID%3A%22TMHQ13C0073%22&x=21&y=14# the main contract with FPSweb was signed on Sept 06 for 10 years with a total value of $599 million.

    Does anyone remember who ran the Mint’s numismatic fulfillment system prior to Jan 1, 2009, when PBGS took over?

    If you guessed FPSweb, you are correct. So expect your Mint coin shipments to originate in Memphis again after Oct 1, 2014.

  25. VABEACHBUM says

    @ CO – Nice to see you on the Board. No doubt you have other things holding your attention.

    The other fascinating thing about the dollar coins is the numbers sold in these numismatic products vs the total numbers struck. Even for the 2012 $1 coins, 25-35 percent of the production has yet to be sold. So, while the quantity might be smaller, looks like the Mint is continuing to warehouse some of the residuals.

    @ Larry – Yeah, this revised UPS delivery thing is very frustrating. The Mint directed that change specific to their products, but I’m not sure why. It used to be that you could implement a “station hold” after the first delivery notice, then pick it up the next day. Now, UPS must make all 3 attempts – while acknowledging that no one will be home for the 2nd or 3rd try – before they implement their automatic 5 day hold. My local UPS driver has been very accommodating. Writes a short note on the delivery notice, telling me which UPS stores he’ll hit and when prior to returning to the distro center. Allowed me to circumvent this otherwise painful process several times!!

    As for my RP Buffalo, I received my shipping notice on Friday. But my coin is shipping USPS Priority Mail; scheduled to arrive tomorrow. Unsure as to the reason for the change in service provider??

  26. simon says

    Jon :

    IMHO they did a fantastic job – prompt and professional. I wish it were sooner than Oct 2014. UPS delivery reminds me of a recurring itch.

  27. Larry says

    @VABEACHBUM – when I talked to UPS they said after the third time it is shipped back to the sender. They didn’t say anything about a five day hold. I will have to call them again if I miss the guy today.

  28. Blair J Tobler says

    Regarding Reagan: If I recall the legislation properly, the President in question must be deceased for at least two years, AND all prior Presidents must be deceased as well. That means Jimmy Carter would have to pass fairly soon for Reagan to get a coin – and no, I am not advocating Carter’s passing.

  29. Ray says

    @VABeachBum, I’d be very happy if US Mint products were shipped via USPS Priority. Did you order your RP Buff from the mint? Are you sure USPS Priority was sued? USPS Priority is one of the best services available for its cost. 2-3 days to anywhere in the lower 48. Compared to a 5-6 day delivery service for this (not-smart) FedEx SmartPost. If you’re not going to use UPS or FedEx Next Day or 2nd Day, you should use USPS Priority. That goes for any man woman or child in America. And we’re supporting a federal institution 100% this way. I hope this is true!!

  30. GMS says

    But as we have seen in the past, Congress can do just about whatever they want, how long was Kennedy dead before he went on a coin….2 months? And Eisenhower died die until 1969.

  31. simon says

    Ray : I agree totally. I always use USPS Priority Mail. Their “flat rate” shipping is a great bargain and they have remarkably improved the tracking service in addition to providing $50 basic insurance. I have shipped to many locations even for business.

  32. simon says

    In the ’80s / ’90s the Mint actually used USPS for all their shipments. I often had to take a pink delivery slip to the PO to collect my package the next morning.

  33. says

    VABB and Larry,

    Nice to hear I am not the only one having fits with UPS recently. I had this issue too when I made the mistake of ordering two AtBs, one for me and one for my friend. I was forced to burn a day off from work just to pick up the stupid package. I think it is ridiculous that I cannot go to the UPS center and just present ID and pick the package up there. Do they think someone is going to go there with faked picture IDs and impersonate the buyer? I’ve NEVER had this problem with USPS or FedEx.

    Also, thanks for the kind welcome back! I have been around, just haven’t had much to say in the past few days.

  34. VABEACHBUM says

    @ Larry – Based on my conversations w/ UPS Staff at our regional sort center and Staff at the Nat’l Call Center, the 5-day hold is automatic – unless otherwise directed by the originator. As part of that 5-day hold, they also send out a postal card that servces as a 4th and final notice, as well as a confirmation of the 5 day hold prior to return.

    @ Ray – I agree with everything you’ve said. Absolutely. I also have confirmed that my RP Buffalo is shipping USPS Priority. The Mint provided tracking number is in the USPS format – 22 digits; no 1Z… Make no mistake. I am thrilled about the change.

    @ CO – It is a hassle, for sure. However, this process change was directed by the US Mint. I have yet to encounter any problems setting a hold on any other UPS packages.

  35. joe says

    Personally, I am scared to death when I have to use USPS registered mail…or any king of USPS delivery. I think their Priority mail service is an oxymoron because my first class items arrive much sooner. My problem with USPS registered mail is that it is extremely expensive and USPS doesn’t provide tracking for it. Hence, when I send expensive coins in to be graded, I only find out the coins arrived at the grading company by the email I receive from the grading company. Since it takes a week for USPS registered mail to travel only two states, I am on pins and needles all week (even though I purchase insurance). We’ve had also had problems with UPS and FEDEX, but nothing like USPS…not even close.

  36. simon says

    Joe : Registered mail can be tracked – just use the registered mail ID (on the slip) and you can track it in their system. It usually takes 1-2 days to activate because of the system.

  37. says


    I am not sure if you know, but Carter is 89 on October 1 this year, and Bush I is also 89. Bush also had a major health scare recently. We may well see them on presidential dollars before we get to Reagan.

    I doubt we will see ones for Clinton or W, though, and definitely not for Obama.

  38. Smiledon says

    @ Captain Overkill,
    I know. I am not wishing that anyone dies.
    As it now stands, Reagan is the last one to have a 1 dollar coin.
    Things change in the blink of an eye, as I am told.
    Since I know not what tomorrow brings, I am only stating what is current.

    As for President Obama, I will take the 5th amendment.

  39. gary says

    Jimmy is going strong… he will be around a LOT more time yet. G.B. the 1st will be around as well. Just figure that no more silly golden dollars get made after Ronnie’s buck.

  40. GMS says

    So back to the original statement will Congress/Mint make another push to get rid of the paper dollar and unload all these into circulation.

  41. says

    I want to be clear I am not hoping for either Carter or Bush the elder (or any of the other living presidents) to die! I just wanted to note that both Carter and Bush are very old now, and we might see them on the coins.

  42. Larry says

    @VABEACHBUM – Well I lucked out! Yesturday, when I missed UPS, he cam at 4:50. So I left work early today, got home at 3:00, and the guy showed up in minutes! Whew! I asked him what would happen if I missed it the third day, and he said it goes back, No five day hold. The mint specifically didn’t allow it. So then what? Has anybody here missed the UPS delivery for the full three tries and then called the mint? What does the mint do?

  43. fmtransmitter says

    @Larry: The Mint will send it back out to you AFTER issuing a refund to your card-then re charging your card, waiting until it shows back up TO the Mint, which took a month for me last time, etc etc etc….Hassle…

  44. AkBob says

    I too had a few packages sent thru UPS from the mint and it stated that after 3 missed deliveries they would be held for 5 days and I could go directly to UPS to pick them up. Just seems difficult to get packages when the mint sends them either by UPS or Fed Ex. Fed Ex holds them sometimes for days depending on what service the mint uses with them. I’m not a fan of the USPS but for me, they have been the most dependable and the fastest. I am in Alaska and USPS can deliver faster than either of their two competitors.

  45. says

    this is good info.. would like to see figures compared to mintage levels.

    then we know how many the mint has left and hen sell out can occur

  46. VA Bob says

    Personally after this presidential coin thing is over, I’d like to see all president gone off our coinage. We are a greater nation than a half dozen former presidents. Putting them on began as a tribute, and has unfortunately become the standard. Wishful thinking I know.

  47. gatortreke says

    I asked UPS too about the 3 day delivery attempt and was told there would be a 5 day hold following the 3 attempts but I’m not sure I trust that info, especially given the conflicting info I’m reading here. I was also told that they couldn’t redirect to the local UPS Store either. I missed the first 2 deliveries for the WP set and was worried about the 3rd so I signed the UPS notice and begged them not to return the item to the mint. UPS accepted the signed form and request and left the box in the spot I designated on the notice but I’m not sure that was what they were supposed to do, I think my UPS delivery person just took pity on me.

  48. Doug says

    I’m sure this is regional or something (which it shouldn’t be). I can tell you twice in the last three months I had the same issues with UPS. The funny (well not really) thing is I live up a long hill and my driver knows I’m never home. For the last two years he has always left my “must sign for” packages at my doorstep without a signature. Some packages over $2000 even were left all day at my doorstep.

    I guess the policies changed or he got in trouble. This time since he wouldn’t leave it without signature I came home early to get it. Later when I realized it wasn’t delivered that day I checked online and the driver had marked that I wasn’t home. But I WAS HOME at that time. I called and of course they really didn’t care what I had to say.

    So twice I’ve had the experience of having to wait for three BUSINESS day deliveries to fail and then drive 45 minutes to my UPS station where they did do a 5 day hold automatically.

    Good Luck to all!

  49. joe says

    @simon – I agree that we are supposed to be able to track USPS registered mail…in theory. My experience is that I take it to the PO and ship it registered. They give me a register number that I can then enter into their system to check the item’s status.

    How it’s been working for me is that the item shows up online as being submitted…but then that’s it. It’s happened every time. The last time I asked our local USPS office about tracking and they said it’s a safety precaution (not allowing a person to track a registered package). Ironically, they told me that not even they could track the package in their internal system as it is “hand walked” through the system under lock and key. It sounds odd that they can’t track one of the most expensive (and important as they put it to me) items they ship. The last item I sent to NGC still shows up as having not been delivered, even though I received the coin back from NGC. I will admit that they have never lost one of my registered items (unlike many Priority items), but the pucker factor is extremely high until I find out that that item has been safely delivered…even with insurance.

  50. Zaz says

    The easiest answer to avoiding UPS deliveries from PBGS is to simply rent a USPS PO box. Yes, the UPS hold and pick up policies have changed drastically in the last year. Under $300 is FedEx SmartPost, over $300 is USPS Priority Mail, simple as that. My RP got sent out this morning and will be available for pick up on Thursday.

  51. simon says

    Joe : They (USPS) generally don’t provide day-to-day point-to-point tracking info. I sent some material by Registered Priority – and you are correct – it has just the origin scan and the destination scan info displayed. I checked basic Priority however, and despite the local tracking at origin and destination, it is essentially the same – their procedures may entail putting pad locked mail bags on commercial flights and there is no telling what happens at the intermediate stages.

  52. samuel says

    off topic, anyone knows how to clean old medals? or any service that will clean the old medal and apply some kind of coating on it?

  53. Ray says

    I see how the Native American coins for 2012 add up in this post, but the US Mint’s website says there were 3.08M (D) and 2.8M (P), totaling 5.88 Million. How/why could/would these numbers be off by 2.3 million total uncirculated coins.

    I love the 2012 and 2013 NA designs. I’ll be buying another roll or two before free shipping is over.

  54. VABEACHBUM says

    @ Larry – my most recent of at least 6 different UPS holds was my 2013 PR Buffalo that I had purchased while gold was bottomed during the week of 8/13. The Mint issued the UPS 2nd day ship confirmation to my email just as I was starting a week of travel on 8/25. When I returned home on Labor Day, my neighbor presented me with my three UPS door tag notices for the 28th, 29th, and 30th. As I collected my held mail that Tuesday, the UPS 5-day postal card was at the top of the stack. I took possession at the sort center that Tuesday evening.

    If they are not providing this similar service to you, it may have to do with the size and location of the UPS Distro Center.

  55. Larry says

    Well you can complain about the mint, but looking back at this year yah gotta at least admit we got some truly stunning products, like the enhanced unc eagle, and the RP Buff! Compared to when I was a young collector in the 70’s, the mint is producing wonderful products. Kudos to the mint! Looking forward to the Mount Rushmore 5 OZer.

  56. merryxmasmrscrooge says

    Michael, do you mean…

    2012-P ~1.75 m
    2012-D ~1.75 m

    2013-P 1.14 m (so far)
    2013-D 1.14 m (so far)

    These are record low mintages for the Sacagawea Dollars.
    Might be seeing mintages <1 m soon. Clad looks worthwhile afterall.

  57. Broooster says

    Regarding UPS, what I find to be the easiest thing to do, is to call you local UPS hub, put a hold on your package, using either your address or tracking number, and drop by after work to pick up your goods. My local UPS hub will even let you in the side door to pick up stuff if it is after hrs. I will note, I live in a smaller town, so maybe they are just a little more flexible in that manner, but it sure is handy.

  58. fmtransmitter says

    Can’t say I have been able to add a “white whale” to the stack lately VARich. Nice article. Beautiful coin, wish there many more so we could own one. Maybe a private Mint will soon make some for the public to enjoy.

  59. Larry says

    At the ANA show, they had a complete set of the four different Stellas on display. Needless to say, the were stunning. It stopped me in my tracks, for sure.

  60. Blair J Tobler says

    Going back to who will be on the last coin, the Wikipedia article is wrong. It states that Carter is one of Reagan’s successors, when in fact he preceded Reagan. Reagan beat Carter in his re-election bid.
    Therefore, Reagan can’t get a coin in this series as long as Carter still lives.

  61. Brad says

    Right, Jimmy Carter would have to pass away by early 2014 to meet the requirement for a coin as it is written in the law. An exception would likely be made if he were to die sometime in between, but that’s not guaranteed they would do that. It is likely that they would want to take the series through Reagan if it were possible, though.

    Isn’t it funny how old the former presidents seem to live these days? Most of them are now in their 90’s when they pass. However, the job of BEING the president really seems to take it’s toll on the men. Just look at those comparisons of how they looked at the beginning of their first-term and the beginning of their second-term. The difference is striking! So, it beats the heck out of them WHILE they’re president, but once they leave office they lead a pretty long, comfortable life.

  62. thePhelps says

    Blair – the release schedule on the mint site shows them ending with Ford. The law also only says living presidents can’t be on the dollars. It also states the deceased presidents have to be dead for at least 2 years prior to being considered for the coins… those things tell me Reagan could very well be on the coin – since Carter wouldn’t qualify but Reagan would.

  63. Blair J Tobler says

    Phelps – I reread the law and you’re right – it doesn’t say anything about all previous presidents having passed. But I know I read that somewhere, but can’t for the life of me remember where. I do know the Mint’s website still shows only through Ford on the release schedule.

  64. Brad says

    Yeah, I don’t think the Mint intends to have any gaps in the series. That’s why the release schedule for the First Spouse coins originally ended with Jackie Kennedy. Even though Pat Nixon had died in 1993, “Lady Bird” Johnson was still living when the series first started. Once she died, both she and Pat Nixon were then added to the schedule. Betty Ford has also since been added.

    So, if the Mint intended to make a coin for Reagan, he would already be on the schedule. Since he’s not, we can assume that they don’t intend to add him until Jimmy Carter dies.

  65. GMS says

    Maybe Michael can shed some light on this topic of which President and now which spouse will be the last ones in the series.

  66. Ray says

    Is it possible to have a coin for Carter’s place but have a classic coin, similar to the first spouse coins where the ex-presidents who did not have wives. That would be sweet! Big fan of Reagan here. I hope they get it done one way or another.

  67. Wontaker says

    Let’s us put on a “full court” press to get law changed to get Reagan>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Coin!!!!!!!!!!!

  68. Wes says

    Betty Ford should be the last First Lady in the series. Nancy Reagan, Rosalynn Carter, Barbra Bush, Laura Bush, And Hillary Clinton are still alive.

  69. GMS says

    Didn’t know that the same rules apply to first lady’s/spouses as Presidents, does it say that somewhere?

  70. GMS says

    Heck, Arthur’s Spouse wasn’t even a spouse so obviously they can take greater liberty’s on the spouse coins and medals.

  71. thePhelps says

    GMS – actually the law stated specifically to have an Alice Paul coin for Chester’s spouse… ironically though the law is specific about the president being dead – but the spouse coin contains no such wording. So it is possible that a Reagan coin could be minted and a Nancy Reagan gold coin be minted and she is still alive.

  72. thePhelps says

    After reading the law again… it looks like they allowed for presidents that might die during the mint run. If you read how it is terminated…

    “(8) Termination of program.–The issuance of coins under
    this subsection shall terminate when each President has been so
    honored, subject to paragraph (2)(E), and may not be resumed
    except by an Act of Congress.
    That implies to me they allowed for this to be open ended based on the selection criteria which is paragraph 2(E).

    “(E) Limitation in series to deceased presidents.–
    No coin issued under this subsection may bear the image
    of a living former or current President, or of any
    deceased former President during the 2-year period
    following the date of the death of that President.

    There is nothing stating that it has to stop when encountering a living president, only the criteria for inclusion in the program and when it ends. Also it does read that when it is done – it is done. It takes another act of congress to issue anymore coins when they run out of dead presidents.

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