Opinion: “Good News Is Good News” Vs. “Bad News Is Good News”


The opinions expressed in this article are those of its author and do not necessarily represent the views of Mint News Blog.

by cagcrisp

Since the Great Recession I have constantly heard the phrase “Bad news is good news.” What exactly is that supposed to mean?

During the Great Recession the stock market plunged, bonds yields dived, precious metals skyrocketed, unemployment nearly doubled, and median household income decreased approximately 8 percent. To bring us out of the Great Recession, the Federal Reserve and the U.S. Congress used both fiscal and monetary policy. Even though some policies were politically unpalatable, a number of financial bailouts and stimulus packages were passed, and we did indeed start to come out of recession in late 2009.

During those tumultuous times it was common to hear it said that “bad news is good news.” After the initial, controversial financial bailouts of so many entities in the country, fiscal policy was for the most part abandoned. For whatever reasons, Congress punted the ball. All the heavy lifting to get us out of recession was left to the Federal Reserve in the form of monetary policy. Various named and quantifiable stimulus programs were initiated by the Fed to stimulate the economy. The stock market always referred to these stimulus programs as “the punch bowl.” Sometimes when we got “bad news,” the stock and bond markets would rally on the perception that the Fed would be more accommodating because of the bad news and would maintain the “punch bowl.” Thus the Bad News (economic bad news) would be good for the stock market or bond market.

As we’ve emerged from recession we’ve seen an enormous gulf between Main Street and Wall Street, between working people and those who’ve benefited from the monetary policy enacted and continued by the Federal Reserve. The vast majority of financial benefits achieved coming out of recession have gone to those in financial assets.

For years, AGE’s and ASE’s followed the same trajectory as financial assets. Then, during the period of the Great Recession and coming out of it, gold and silver were a mirror image of financial assets, going up as financial assets went down. The trend reversed as the Great Recession peaked: metals began to go down as financial assets went up. This switched again in December 2015, and for months after Brexit, gold and silver rose again as financial assets dropped.

I’ve never been in the camp that believes that for precious metals to go up, financial assets have to go down. For years, AGE’s and ASE’s followed the same trajectory as financial assets. The divergence has occurred since the Great Recession, but I believe that possibly—just possibly—after the election we can get back on track, where good news is good news and precious metals will rise with the good news. Most will not agree with my opinion; however, I think we have a possibility. It has happened before, and I think it will happen again.

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  1. Scott says

    When the news media is in the tank for the current administration, there is no such thing as bad news. Unfortunately, all the monetary stupidity of the last eight years will eventually come home to roost. The Fed should have normalized interest rates in 2011.

  2. Dustyroads says

    I view gold as an indicator, but only as long as it’s being used as a safe haven asset. During the x generation period, gold held reliable support but saw little volatility. Now that gold is demanding much more respect, it’s going to continue it’s voyage until evident key indicators are looking more inclined towards growth.
    I like your positive attitude cagcrisp. I hope you are correct.

  3. data dave says

    This blog just got more interesting with “guest” columnists. I think you hit the nail on the head when you state that “For whatever reasons, Congress punted the ball. All the heavy lifting to get us out of recession was left to the Federal Reserve in the form of monetary policy”. I no longer blame the fed. I think they are trying to hold things together the best that they can with an inept congress that hasn’t really addressed any economic problems in years. Good news will go back to being good news when the US congress gets it act back together. In the meantime let’s hack people’s email accounts and discuss body parts.

  4. cagcrisp says

    @data dave, “I no longer blame the fed. I think they are trying to hold things together the best that they can with an inept congress that hasn’t really addressed any economic problems in years.”

    I agree completely. The Fed did what they had to do Because there was no fiscal policy out of Congress…

  5. Montana John says

    @Cagcrisp et.al. thank -you for your insights and hard work….. @mint news blog…regarding your assessment of the 2017 high relief liberty coin as “a beautiful design” personally I just don’t get in my IMHO…nor would I purchase it

  6. The Real "Cool" Brad says

    With a second child on the way this coming January, I highly doubt I will have the means to purchase the 2017 HRL Coin. However, I agree with @mint news blog, it is a nice design and I would purchase it in silver if this design will carry over to the silver medal. I would hope they would keep the same reverse as the 2015 HRL coin.

  7. Sith says

    “Bad news is good news.” What exactly is that supposed to mean? It means we are all currency traders. Everything depends on Fed policy. IE if the economy is tanking the Fed will print more money.

    “For whatever reasons, Congress punted the ball”….No its called blackmailed. “don’t forget that Bernanke was telling Congress that the economy would collapse if it did not approve the $700 billion TARP bailout.

    The Fed had to do what they had to do to save the banks, but if printing money leads to prosperity, Zimbabwe and Venezuela would be the most prosperous counties on the planet.

    I hate to say this, especially as cagcrisp is a viable contributor, but this article is bunk, especially when in the article is states that “All the heavy lifting to get us out of recession was left to the Federal Reserve in the form of monetary policy. Then it is quickly supersedes that statement with the following “an enormous gulf between Main Street and Wall Street, between working people and those who’ve benefited from the monetary policy enacted and continued by the Federal Reserve.” IE it does not sound like the Fed policy was the most effective manner to get us out of the recession, if it mostly benefited the few, at the expense of the many,, then add that it does not even mention the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008.

    Anyway We have gone from articles that expressing coin facts, and leaving opinions in the comments section, to having articles express an opinions, and IMHO a contradictory one at that. This sets a dangerous precedence for this blog.

  8. Mike in NY says

    I have to agree with the last paragraph of Sith’s post. I miss that focus on coin fact related articles like we saw when Michael and then Dan managed the blog. No disrespect to Diana but I do not care for the direction the blog has taken.

    I have followed and occasionally commented here for the past 3 years but now find myself losing interest. There seems to be a lot of pessimism and political discussion that was not as prevalent before. Perhaps time to find or start a coin blog more like the original Mint News Blog.

  9. Throckmorton says

    I have to agree with Sith and Mike. There are too many places on the web to read about the recent or impending disasters caused by fiscal policy and way too few places to go for mint information.

  10. Dustyroads says

    Diana, I too, as Mike in NY has expressed, hope that this phenomenal blog can remain on track as it has over the past several years.
    When the first new stories were presented after your assuming the role as Editor, I hoped they would be received well. It appears they have been and all looks good. However, as mundane as simple…Mint news….stories can be from time to time, they still seem to satisfy something in a large audience here.
    I hope I’m not being misunderstood, I have a good feeling about what you’re doing.

  11. Mint News Blog says

    Many thanks to each of you for sharing your opinions on the direction of Mint News Blog, including (or especially) the critical viewpoints. To ease your minds, let me first say that the blog hasn’t taken a true direction just yet—some of the articles you’ve observed these last five weeks are more along the lines of litmus testing than setting a new direction. The long-form, serialized article by Ed Moy is an example; the post on the cashless economy was another. The idea of a once-a-month opinion piece is still another. I’ve been watching carefully to see how each piece is received, getting feed back via emails as well as the comment threads

    When our favorite provocateur said last week that he was free to leave, while I was “here to serve,” he seemed to think he was dealing quite an insult. I see nothing insulting in the idea of serving the readers; my view is that if you don’t care what the readers want, why go to the trouble of setting up a site and delivering content? Yes, I’m here to serve, and proud of it. I’m on the prowl for new things that might interest you, but I also want to keep providing the content you like. We have part 3 of Mr. Moy’s piece lined up for tomorrow, and I’ll pop back in later this evening with something extra that’s more along the lines of MNB’s regular content.

    Please keep the opinions coming. Positive, negative, insightful, grumpy—it’s all valuable!

  12. Louis Golino, Author says

    “Bad news is good news” is a phrase used frequently in the financial media to refer to situations when negative data about the economy is perceived by the market as good news because it means interest rates will not be increased in the near future. Good news is bad news is the opposite where good date is seen as bad for stocks because it means rates are more likely to go up.

    One correction: PM’s actually hit their low’s at the height of the Great Recession in late 2008 and hit their all time highs when the economy had been in recovery for two years. Whether or not you personally felt it, the recession technically ended in 2009.

  13. Felson says

    I for one enjoy cagcrisp’s opinion piece. I’ve also enjoyed the various other articles that have been presented recently.

    I will say I am not a fan of the FED’s monetary policy and the “lingering” effect it has had. They should have restored the system long ago.

  14. MarkInFlorida says

    I don’t think the recession ever ended, it just looks like it because the Fed has printed trillions of dollar, and is buying up assets to keep the prices from crashing. Every time the stock market crashes or gold surges they step in and stop it. They even got the Swiss national bank to buy US stocks. I think it’s the biggest bubble in history that will eventually have to crash, which is why I’m stacking.

  15. 1958 Chevrolet Bel Air says

    Here’s a crazy idea, let’s put classic cars on the back of one of our coins.

  16. So Krates says

    I welcome the new diversity here. Good to have some flaava. After Michael left and before Diana arrived, I was starting to think some of the articles were computer generated. No seriously I did

  17. Mike says

    I like the diversity of content. Thank-you Cagcrisp and Diana; you’re both doing a great job!

    I also love traditional articles about the mint, mint insider views, stories about coins and technologies the mint uses, etc.

    OT but I’m bummed that I will be working on Nov 17 at 9am PST, although I don’t believe the walking liberties will sellout in minutes. I’ll have to wait until evening.


  18. Mint News Blog says

    Well, folks, the joke’s on me for making a brazen promise to fetch some fresh U.S. Mint news for you this evening. I was sure that I could dig something up if I looked hard enough, but after more than an hour of futile searching I remembered that the reason I scheduled the lengthy insider report this week was that the Mint’s schedule was an echo chamber. For Coin Update, I reported that the Mint announced the ceremonial first strike of Lions Club commemoratives in November (https://goo.gl/xLyNr0), but that doesn’t seem like anything that would remotely interest you; and you already know about the Reagan Coin & Chronicles HHL, which isn’t big news anyway. The gold Krugerrand and Sovereign have big anniversaries next year, but that’s not a U.S. Mint topic (although you might enjoy the stories on Coin Update and World Mint News Blog).

    One thing I did discover was that we (and by “we,” I mean “I”) neglected to provide a September 2016 Circulating Coin Production report. I’ll do a double report next week, showing the September and October reports separately in the same post.

    Again, thank you to everyone who has commented. Let me know if there’s an important subject that’s being neglected, and I’ll do my best to cover it.

  19. RSF says

    I was hoping that this month-long hole in the Mint’s product schedule would be a time for them to announce a few surprises that we’ve fanaticized about here over the year. A three- coin grouping of the tribute coins, (or at least a nice display box ) an ASE anniversary set containing something unique, or even just decisions to discontinue or change our current circulating coins. They’ve still got several weeks, but it doesn’t look promising.

    Thanks for filling this void with some interesting reading. I think your strategy for the blog is sound. Your ‘litmus testing ‘ new features and absorbing feedback is fine, but don’t feel stressed to produce something when the Mint doesn’t provide.

  20. Jerry Diekmann says

    MarkinFlorida – I agree with your assessment – the Great Recession may have technically ended in 2009, but more many Americans, the recession still continues. The banks and Wall Street seem to be happy, and that is apparently all that really counts for the leaders of our country.

    Sorry if I’m being too political – we should get more down to discussing coins, but it is a slippery slope, since coins reflect how are our government operates, and that is why we have seen such disasters as the Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, National Park Service (which should have, and could have been a winner), FS 1/2 oz. gold pieces, Presidential dollars (why do we have dollar coins anyway?) , some of the designs of the ATB quarters, the US Mint following the RCM in minting way too many different kinds of coins and finishes (simpler is actually better, and less is actually sometimes better than more when it comes to coins, accidents, and plagues). Next year we get to see Mint artists draw some lions – I guess because they are big cats and we don’t have any of them in our country. The Mint has completely lost its focus and its experiments with mintage and household limits is driving more people away from the hobby than it is attracting.

  21. Mattarch says

    If you are looking for some US Mint News, how about information on whether they are still running three shifts a day at the mint to produce the ASE. If production remained at 1 million per week over the summer there would have been around 40 million produced but only around 34 million have been purchased from the mint. Does that mean they have 6 million sitting in a warehouse somewhere and will distributing the surplus delay the release of the 2017 Bullion coins? I have not seen production numbers on the ASE, only distribution numbers. Just curious.

  22. bobo says

    Cag, Peter Schiff explains why your views are too sanguine and why a currency crisis lies in our future, not in our past:
    If short on time start at 16:40. This is why I am getting out of paper and digital money asap and into real things that hold or increase value.

    Discussions of the Fed and the new push by the elite to eliminate cash are VERY relevant to this blog. Being too narrowly focused is boring. It is because of Fed printing that the buying power of a dollar is one twentieth what it was when they took over in 1913. It is because of the Fed that they now want to eliminate coins so they can confiscate your digital money and call that ‘negative interest’. If anything, I think this blog should address even broader issues, because the mint and our money do not exist in a vacuum. The nature of our money is central to the functioning of our civilization. Its degrading is central to the degrading of our lives and society because it undermines trust, both interpersonally and in our institutions.

    Here are some possible topics:

    Who are the elite who want to eliminate cash? Who do Rogoff, Summers, Krugman, Greenspan, Bernanke and Yellen serve?
    Is the Fed constitutional? Who wants to eliminate it and why? Who formed it and why?
    Does the mint live up to the coinage act of 1792?
    Will the mint be allowed to sell silver/gold bullion if the elites succeed in imposing a new digital dollar under their sole control?
    Are there parallels in history for our present dilemmas that we could learn from? (Diocletian? Weimar?)
    Is there really gold left in Ft. Knox?
    Why are other central banks buying up gold like mad?
    What legislation is in the pipeline that would effect our money or its mintage?

    Guest posts are great. More the better. Bring in some deep thinkers on sound money like Ron Paul, Mike Maloney, Peter Schiff, Doug Casey, or Jim Rickards. Tell us who you will interview and allow us to send in questions. You’re doing a great job Diana, thanks!

  23. Yes, But...You Can't Take It With You says

    I agree wholeheartedly with the last previous posts of Bobo and Jerry D. We are definitely in a huge bubble and when it bursts it will not be a pretty sight. I always appreciate that Cag is looking toward the future in order to think wisely about coin buying today but it is also helpful to look at the history/constitutionality of the monetary policy that we currently “enjoy”.

    Those on this blog who always target the Big Banks / Wall Street as being the culprits: Surely you know that the banks and WS could not possibly pull all of this off without the help of politicians – on both sides of the aisle – the current Administration begin perhaps the worst offender?

    Diana – I like the new direction as long as it is used as “filler” for slow “news days” on the Mint front. When there are actual products being rolled out I think that most of us would like to use our time to track with that. Not that the Mint gives us much to work with these days… Thanks for your good work!

  24. J. Miller says

    If silver goes to $30/oz, I’ll be happy. $50/oz I’m dumping half. If I have anything left and it goes to $75, I’ll be mad I started selling at $30… 🙂 😉
    I did very well in 2010, but I held a lot of silver for 13 years! I hope I don’t have to wait too long for the next run…I’ve bought a lot since 2013, averaged in at $18/oz… right now. I plan on buying a lot more, but I’ll stop buying if silver goes to $18 and hold ’till $30.
    All thoughts welcome 🙂

  25. bobo says

    This is another great interview with Peter Schiff this month explaining just how wrong Cag’s sanguine perspective is on the Fed, and how the coming dollar crisis will impoverish millions of Americans who failed to see this coming, and who failed to get out of dodge before the dollar crash by switching their wealth into hard assets and safe foreign assets.
    I hope everyone here gets out of dodge before it is too late.

  26. Erik H says

    J. Miller, sounds like a good plan but here’s another that you might like.

    Sell some silver when the gold to silver ratio goes to say 50 (silver) to 1 (gold). Use the money to buy gold. As the ratio moves higher say where we are currently at, sell the gold and buy more silver.

    As the ratio gets closer to a historic average of 16 to 1 or even the 1980 5 to 1 average, you would have picked up a lot of free PM along the way.

    Most predict that silver will out perform gold so this should work right alongside with what you’d like to do.

  27. Sith says

    @Mint News Blog – I just find it ironic, that arguably, the most knowledgeable “facts, and figures”poster on this blog. One that can spot pricing trends on E-bay, and has even been asked by a few fellow readers to tone his posts on figures, and pricing trends down, writes an opinion piece.

    @bobo – I like Peter Schiff, but he has issues. The biggest issue with Peter Schiff, is that he talks up his book. As such following his advice can be hazardous to your portfolio. The old saying, “the market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent,” is in play here. The main issue I have with Peter Schiff, is he, like many economist, and financial broker/dealer, who see the dangers of the Fed’s monetary policy clearly, simply view it as incompetents, rather than corrupt. He then bases his analysis on the Fed’s incompetence, and like those that base their analysis on economic indicators, they get burned because the Fed marches to the beat of its own drums.

  28. Louis Golino, Author says

    I enjoyed CC’s post and like the idea of guest posts as well as ones on topics besides those that deal directly with coins. I also appreciate Diana’s efforts and her direct engagement with posters and readers, something previous editors rarely did.

    I am not surprised that opinion is divided on this post as it reflects the deep divide over Fed policy among politicans and experts. I see merit’s in both perspectives. But remember that Peter Schiff sells gold and has a vested interest in wanting you to believe his views.

  29. Louis Golino, Author says

    @Sith- What’s wrong with an opinion piece? The vast majority of comments on every post are mini-opinion pieces. In fact, I consider CC’s post to be an analysis and a good one at that.

  30. gatortreke says

    Diana, I’ll add my 2 cents that I like spicing things up a bit with official opinion posts like this one. I don’t want it all the time but when intermixed with regular coin posts, it is great. Given we’re all interested in coins, we have a basic or better interest in monetary policy, economics, etc… to some degree. The thing that impresses me with this thread is there hasn’t been any name calling, mud slinging, etc…, just commentary and rebuttal and I personally love this because I am here to learn as much as I can and there is nothing to learn if we all believe the same thing. The key is civility.

    Regarding Cag’s opinion post, I question whether Congress punting the ball has any real relevance. I tend to believe that once the Fed was involved, they were here to remain and whatever Congress did would have had only marginal influence on Fed policy actions. Personally, I think they like being the center of attention, it is one of the reasons they have stepped up their “transparency” as it give them more face time for the media, more overall attention. This goes for all the world central banks. The various world governments have responded differently to the various crises but it appears to me it is the central banks who are all at the center of the response. I don’t think this is an accident, it is a coordinated response.

  31. Erik H says

    I don’t know if I need to add to my comment earlier to J. Miller, “this is no financial advice” but… “IT’S NOT FINANCIAL ADVICE”.

    It’s just in idea, since he ask for some. I buy gold, silver, platinum & numismatic. Over time my cost will average out. But since the majority of what I get is silver I plan on using the gold / silver ratio to add my “free” oz. of PMs the next time it drops to around 50. Most of my silver has been purchased in the 75 range.

    Hopefully silver will eventually get back a historical ratio, then many stackers will be smiling.

  32. Erik H says

    Here’s something I wanted to post last weekend, like most, I believe that the platinum to gold ratio will reverse back to a historical Platinum over Gold ratio.

    But if you buy Platinum Proof Eagles direct from the mint, you better really like the coin and hope to hold it long term.

    There’s a very small market for numsimatic Platinum. Most dealers don’t want to buy unless it’s close to spot. So you’re left with eBay and their fees plus risk of a bad transaction of a high dollar purchase. Or an auction house which takes time to conduct while the spot price might possibly drop during the time it takes to sell your coin adding its own risk. Just my two cents, buy what you like!

  33. Sith says

    @Louis Golino – I already stated that the comments section was a valid place for opinion. Cagcrisp has now posted in an official capacity for US Mint News, his opinion is now the opinion of US Mint News. That opinion is cheer-leading the Federal Reserve, while bad mouthing the Congress that they blackmailed. I don’t consider passing TARP (right or wrong) to be punting the ball. I can write articles about how the Fed is corrupt\incompetent. Then add that ” All the heavy lifting to get us out of recession was left to the Federal Reserve in the form of monetary policy,” that is the entire reason why we have the Federal Reserve. IE that is their job. You’re now telling me that you’re surprised that Congress let the Fed do its job? All this is now the opinion of US MInt News, get the picture?

    Secondary critique “I believe that possibly—just possibly—after the election we can get back on track, where good news is good news and precious metals will rise with the good news. ” That is a fine statement, can you elaborate why you believe that will happen? What is so special about the election? Inquiring minds want to know.

    Zero Hedge use to be a good financial blog, biased but good, then they started to allow people to post “opinions.” The current headlines for Zero Hedge: “Clinton Struggles To Contain WikiLeaks Damage As Voters Grow Weary Of The Constant Scandals,” “The Establishment Has Rigged the System: It’s Time to Shake Things Up,” and “Putin Asks: “Is America Now A Banana Republic.” have little to do with fiance. I don’t want the article here to go the way of Zero Hedge, but if push comes to shove I will do as I do there, ignore the “opinion” article and jut read articles like “Q3 GDP Jumps 2.9% On Rise In Inventory And Exports, Offset By Weak Consumption And Investment.”

  34. Zaz says

    What happened to MNB? I appreciate the different contributors and the intriguing things they have to say, but I feel the general tone seems to be trending away the Mint and their woeful product schedule and replaced with partisan opinions as central discussion pieces. Perhaps the histories and op-ed pieces could be placed along a sidebar so they are not front and central to the essential purpose of this blog, which in my opinion is to inform collectors and investors of current and upcoming mint products and to have spirited discussions of the same. Case in point, NO one is talking about the gold Walker half to be issued in three weeks. it’s as if the impending issue is effectively dead in the water. I have a number of political and financial blogs I follow and if Mint News Blog is going in that direction, I’ll be glad to delete it from my lists of coin- and bullion- related websites. Please don’t get me wrong, Diana, I appreciate what you do, but Dan and Mike never took the blog quite off the rails like this. Thank you for reading and listening.

  35. Doug says

    I agree with Zaz! No disrespect to Diana and just my opinion and to let her know I’m less interested in checking this blog every day.

  36. Zaz says

    Another case in point: The last “real” hard news piece was the Reagan C&C first day sales on October 12th, more than two weeks ago. What happened to the MNB piece about the Reagan C&C HHL being lifted? I have used the timeline of MNB articles to research coin sales and selling history which is useful back to about 2009 or so, but if it’s going in a political direction it will be useless as predictor of future US Mint purchases. Just sayin’.

  37. Zaz says

    Another MNB piece that could’ve been presented is the 5th bullion ATB puck of 2016 Fort Moultrie/South Carolina is now on presale at various APs, for delivery starting November 28th, did anybody here notice or care? I certainly didn’t find out from the bloggers here, as I like Doug have stopped reading everyday. (Once upon a time, I made hourly visits.)

  38. Dustyroads says

    It looks like the Mint has tweaked the payment page at usmint.gov. I ran through it to familiarize myself with it and it does seem faster. This change like the other recent changes appear to streamline content for faster loading and operation. There are some things on the website that look substandard compared to the Perth or APMEX’s websites, so hopefully they can get it together.

  39. Louis Golino, Author says

    @Sith- As I see it, you are interpreting CC”s post as an editorial of MNB, which it is not as far as I can tell, rather than an opinion with a byline. It’s just like the difference between the last two pages of most major newspapers that have the paper’s editorial’s on the left side page and letters to the editor, and then various opinions with named bylines on the page to the right that do not reflect the paper’s views. In fact, the whole point of op-eds is to publish diverse views that only represent the views of the writer. I don’t see anything that says CC’s post was any kind of official opinion of this site/blog.

  40. Louis Golino, Author says

    By the way, the recent info. on customer demographics of the Mint’s buyers only showed part of the story. If you look at the full info. taken from Mint surveys, many of you will be shocked to learn that 51% of the Mint’s current customer base is female. I have not seen all the data but there is a story on it on another site today.

  41. Larry says

    Many moons ago, back in the 70’s. I read a book by Peter Schiff’s father, Irwin Schiff called “The Biggest Con” It talked all about what is money, gold and silver, inflation, social security, the Fed, etc…. I got so worried the economy was going to collapse I turned much of my meager funds into Krugerands for $200.00/ oz. I did sell them for $600.00/ OZ, so I did make out OK at the time. It was the time of the great inflation. But the economy did not collapse, although we do go through a pretty big recession due to the Fed raising interest rates to like 20%.
    You have to be careful with doom and gloom. Peter seems to be taking over where his dad left off.

  42. earthling says

    I recently got rid of an anchor that’s been dragging me down for the last 6 years . She had substance abuse problems along with emotional problems. She is now a guest of the county so at least I don’t need to worry about her – too much – and hopefully things will improve for me. I come back to a quiet smoke-free environment and get my much needed sleep now.

    Soon I might be doing 7/12’s again and I’ll be in the mood for a really nice and expensive Coin. Come on US Mint, get on the ball. Give us something good and pricey. That WLH isn’t doing it for me. The Apollo project is too far off. A late Panama Pacific monster slug redo would be right on time.

  43. Louis Golino, Author says

    comment above should be 51% of U.S. customer base is female, not overall customer base of the Mint.

  44. cagcrisp says

    The article that Louis referenced is mixing Overall Mint customers vs. U.S. Mint customers. One of the things that I got out of the article is just how much More wealthy the non-U.S. customers vs, U.S. customers are…

    Current Overall Mint customers for FY2015:

    36% Over $100,000 income
    35% between $50-$100,000
    14% between $30-$50,000
    16% Under $30,000

    Contrast that to the Current U.S. Mint customers for FY2015:

    12% Over $100,000 income
    26% between-$50-$100,000
    18% between $30-$50,000
    45% Under $30,000

  45. Sith says

    @Louis Golino – Those editorial have a disclaimer, I believe you should have an opt-out policy rather than a opt-in policy. How about adding the following:

    The opinions, beliefs and viewpoints expressed by the various authors on this web site do not necessarily reflect the opinions, beliefs and viewpoints of US Mint News

  46. Mike in NY says

    I’m surprised the US over $100,000 income percentage is so low and the under $30,000 percentage is so high. I’m definitely in the minority and I imagine most of the other bloggers here are as well. I spend approximately $6,000 to $10,000 a year on mint offerings on top of other numismatic purchases (ancient Greek coins, pre-1933 gold). At $30,000 or less my numismatic spending would be miniscule at best.

  47. Louis Golino, Author says

    Aren’t any of you shocked that 51% of US Mint customers are female? I often hear folks lament how the hobby will die when all the older, white males pass, but I have always suspected that those who buy modern Mint products are not the same old guys you see at coin shows buying Morgans and old gold. They are younger and female and hopefully are not going anywhere.

  48. gatortreke says

    Can someone explain to me the difference between Overall Mint customers and US Mint customers? Does this mean those within the U.S. boundaries versus all buyers worldwide? US Mint website accounts versus bullion dealers? I’m not clear as to what the difference is.


  49. cagcrisp says

    @Louis Golino, Author, “Aren’t any of you shocked that 51% of US Mint customers are female?”

    I was Shocked by Many of the revelations for the U.S. customers…

  50. Sith says

    @cagcrisp – Your last post is exactly what in my feeble way I was trying to address. You just posted facts, and I would love to read your opinion about what those facts mean for future US Mint sales, and offerings. Your actual article about the Federal Reserve’s policies effect on PM prices is shall we say is less interesting to me.

  51. says

    @Eric, that historic gold/silver ratio of 16 to 1, is just that…old, old history and is no longer meaningful. If we had that ratio today, gold would only be $285

    The current ratio is 71 to 1….1276/17.87

    The ratio was lower in 2011 (43 to 1) when gold peaked at $1880 and silver at $43.49….based on London fixes, not intra day highs.

    I do agree with you in that I think silver will outperform gold long term.

  52. Sith says

    @Louis Golino – It does not surprise me, but I doubt they are buying for themselves. They are most likely buying gifts. The Happy Birthday Coin Set, and Birth Set come to mind.

  53. Mint News Blog says

    @Sith, it won’t be a surprise when I say I agree with @Louis Golino on this, but I do like your idea of a disclaimer. Such things are, indeed, pretty standard, and I’ll add one to the piece now. Any future opinion pieces will have a disclaimer as well. Thank you for the suggestion! And don’t worry, it’s not my aim to clutter MNB with op-eds — this will be a once-in-a-while thing, and all readers are welcome to submit suggestions. (That doesn’t mean I’ll use every suggested opinion piece; just the ones that fit the editorial calendar, require a minimum of editing, and are relevant to current Mint and/or economic events.)

  54. says

    Just to add to my previous comment on the historic 16 to 1 gold silver ratio….if that held true today silver would be almost $80/oz……so the question would be, is gold overvalued or silver Undervalued?

    Do any posters pay much attention to these Rations? And if so, what is your Strategy? Thanks

  55. Sith says

    @Steve – That is the ratio that silver is mined as compared to gold, so as a PM it is not “old history.” The assumption is that silver will fulfill its traditional role as money, as such that ratio needs to come down to more historical levels.

    My 2 cents

    If you don’t believe that silver will fulfill its historical role as money, then you will still have to address its industrial side. Decades if not centuries of stored silver, have gone the way of the Dodo. In fact the main contributor for the removal of silver from our currency was that industrial production was outstripping supply Per President Johnson himself.

    “Now, all of you know these changes are necessary for a very simple reason–silver is a scarce material. Our uses of silver are growing as our population and our economy grows. The hard fact is that silver consumption is now more than double new silver production each year. So, in the face of this worldwide shortage of silver, and our rapidly growing need for coins, the only really prudent course was to reduce our dependence upon silver for making our coins.”

    Silver is more rare than the so called ‘Rare earth elements,” and is more critical in industrial applications. That makes that ratio every important. All the increased ratio did was make it unprofitable to go mining for silver, and now most silver production is a by-product of other mining such as gold, and copper., and that will remain that way until prices adjust to make it profitable to extract on its own merit.

  56. Mint News Blog says

    @Zaz — Please see my reply to @Sith’s comment, which I happened to encounter first in the thread.

  57. Mint News Blog says

    It’s interesting that you mention this, because we were just discussing on World MNB that the South Africa Mint’s ordering page seems to be designed to actually discourage direct sales. I wonder how all the major mint pages would rank in comparison.

  58. Mint News Blog says

    @Zaz — To be honest, the lifting of the HHL on that particular product seemed to be generating a collective yawn on the Internet. In retrospect, I should have covered it anyway, and in future I’ll be sure to do so. I’m interested in getting MNB back to a place you’ll want to check hourly! Please hang in there over the course of the next week or two, and let me know how I’m doing. Your comments are very welcome and highly instructive, so please keep them coming.

  59. Sith says

    @Mint News Blog – I don’t object to the course of action being taken, I was just surprised with the topic. The topic seems more in tune with a political\economical blog than a coin blog.

  60. Mint News Blog says

    @Sith — (This is a revision to my previous comment, which I posted before proofing.) I saw that one as well, but I wasn’t sure what to make of it. There’s a little wiggle room in the phrase “start to ship” — to many of us, it means that existing orders will go in the mail that day, but it could just as easily mean that it’s the day when the retailer will begin to pack the orders. And in any case, it’s easy to promise early delivery and later blame the Mint for any delay. It’s also possible that the Mint had a typo in the info for their retailers, and the date should have been December 28. I mean to cast no aspersions on Provident Metals or anyone else who has put up this date; no doubt they have it on good authority from the Mint that the product will be in their building, ready to ship, on the 28th. I’m just explaining why I was reluctant to run with the information as a story.

    In your experience, are retailers generally able to deliver U.S. Mint products ahead of the official release dates?

  61. says

    @Sith, I respectfully disagree with you (I could be wrong ), but the historic ratio of gold/ silver ratio has ALWAYS been a ratio of price, not production.

    Anyone else care to clarify our difference in what the ratio means…price or production?

  62. says

    Sith, as you can see on the chart on the link Gatoreke provided, you can see the gold/silver ratio is based on price, not production…always has been!

  63. Louis Golino, Author says

    definitely price, though of course looking at production is useful too, though not part of the ratio that has been used for so long. besides, it is hard to get definitive data on production.

  64. Qui Transtulit Sustinet says


    Opinion Week at the Mint News Blog !

    I agree one of the strengths of this blog is the diversity of opinion and the respect most posters show for the right of others to express their opinion.

    Regarding Diana’s “new direction”, I feel there needs to be more than an indirect nexus between Blog opinion pieces and numismatic content. Otherwise, the Blog is in danger of becoming even more of an acknowledged or stealth political or economic forum than it already has. I believe most of us come here to read, learn, and converse about US Mint products—past, current, and future.

    Given the recent popularity of the Liberty silver medals and the bronze and silver medals in the C & C sets, my suggestion for content is more, and more in depth, articles on the many medals the US Mint has produced.

    In the spirit of ‘Opinion Week’, if you are still reading, here are a few of mine—

    —Enjoyed and agreed with cagcrisp’s opinion piece, but felt it teetered on the edge of of blog relevance for lack of numismatic content.

    All markets are cyclical…”bubbles” come and go…short term perspectives are often misleading…investments in both stocks and precious metals can assist working people to improve their financial wealth, gradually, over time, if they are willing to take on short term risk and a long term investment horizon.

    The do-nothing, broken US Congress has created a policy vacuum, in economic and many other areas, which results in inaction or necessary initiatives by other entities.

    If 51% of US Mint customers are female, I am shocked…to the point of disbelief.

    I really like the Moultrie ATB, although the details, especially of the British ships, could have been much better.

    Frankly, I feel greater presentation/discussion of the historical background of coin and medal design themes is more in keeping with the spirit of the US Mint Blog than the recent drift toward non-numismatic economic and political themes. I posted some of the background on Fort Moultrie months ago when another poster characterized the theme as a random flag waver and don’t recall getting one comment.


  65. gatortreke says

    To further comment on the 51% US Mint customers being female , I have to say I’m surprised by that as well. I can’t help but wonder how much a show like Mike Meezak’s Coin Vault, on Home Shopping Network influences women in this country. My coin buddy makes fun of Meezak because his coins are usually/always overpriced compared to buying directly from the Mint or other online or coin show dealers (of course his overhead is a lot higher) but he may be providing a useful service, introducing coins to the predominantly female Home Shopping Network viewership. Just a thought.

  66. Mike says

    I for one am thrilled to have such a responsive manager of the blog. Thank-you Diana for listening and doing such a good job keeping things interesting.

    If there is no major news to report, I personally don’t see the harm in an occasional opinion piece with a clearly-labeled by-line so we know it’s not the Mint’s opinion.

    I would be interested in a post about the upcoming gold walking half. I check the mint site everyday to see if details are yet posted about it.

    Well it’s impossible to please everyone. It only results in a really ugly camel.

    @Sith, I agree with your assessment:

    “The main issue I have with Peter Schiff, is he, like many economist, and financial broker/dealer, who see the dangers of the Fed’s monetary policy clearly, simply view it as incompetents, rather than corrupt. He then bases his analysis on the Fed’s incompetence, and like those that base their analysis on economic indicators, they get burned because the Fed marches to the beat of its own drums.”

    So many act like what is happening is boobery or incompetence, when in fact it’s calculated moves. Mere incompetence should land the bad decisions at 50%.


  67. Qui Transtulit Sustinet says

    Latest pet peeve–Would MNB posters who post about US Mint five ounce silver ATB’s please take the few minutes required to obtain clarity on the difference between the bullion and (vapor blasted) numismatic version with the ‘P’ mint mark? Yes, two different finishes with distinct distribution channels exist.

  68. Sith says

    “Prior to 1900, the gold-to-silver ratio hovered around 16…The U.S. Geological Survey estimates that there’s 17.5 times more silver in the Earth’s crust than gold, which could provide another explanation for the pre-1900 gold-to-silver ratio average.”

    “Since 1687, as far back as records reach, the ratio vacillated in a range of approximately 14:1 to 100:1. For much of the 19th and early 20th centuries, the ratio hovered around 16:1 as many countries were using gold or silver backed paper currencies. The United States and France were among several countries backing their currency with gold and both countries assigned statutory limits as to what the ratio could be. Also, the U.S. Geological Survey estimates there is 17.5 times more silver in the Earth’s crust than gold, which may substantiate the long held 16:1 ratio to some degree.”

    In 1787 the United States Constitution established gold and silver as the legal tender of the United States at a floating exchange rate. Then in 1792, Secretary of the Treasury Alexander Hamilton proposed fixing the silver to gold exchange rate at 15:1, as well as establishing the mint for the public services of free coinage and currency regulation “in order not to abridge the quantity of circulating medium.” With its acceptance, Sec.11 of the Coinage Act of 1792 established: “That the proportional value of gold to silver in all coins which shall by law be current as money within the United States, shall be as fifteen to one, according to quantity in weight, of pure gold or pure silver;” the proportion had slipped by 1834 to sixteen to one. Bimetallism was effectively abandoned by the Coinage Act of 1873.”

    “The genesis of the Gold to Silver Ratio strategy may have begun with the early notion that there is a “natural” relationship between the value of gold and silver because of its defined legal tender value. And there is at least anecdotal evidence that the Gold to Silver Ratio advocates co-opted early bimetallism as part of their explanation as to the importance of the ratio.”

  69. says

    MNB/Diana….I am not going to comment on anyone’s experience, but for myself. You asked
    “In your experience, are retailers generally able to deliver U.S. Mint products ahead of the official release dates?”

    My response to your question are retailers “generally” are able deliver U.S. Mint products ahead of the official release date, is that NO…Never, with one exception….that being Mint products sold at things like ANA coin shows are sometimes available in limited quantities before the product is available to buy online. But that caused a lot of angst among collector’s and I don’t think the Mint will do that again.

    Now, several online companies…MCM, APMEX, Provident, JM Bullion, etc have been preselling the Fort Moultrie 5 oz bullion ATB for a couple of weeks….with an expected ship date of around 11/28/16. That is when the Mints “Authorized Purchasers” expect delivery. Of the companies I listed above, APMEX is the only one on the list of “Authorized Purchasers”, so their pre-sales should ship first….but for some reason, they usually ship about the same time as other retailers.

    Many people on ebay presale Mint products….whether it be a ATB bullion coin or the upcoming Gold Walking Liberty half dollar. Ebay requires that any pre-sale must be delivered within 30 days of purchase…or the buyer can cancel the transaction for a full refund or just wait if he thinks his price is fair.

    But to answer your original question….retailers, nor anyone else, can obtain or send you a U.S Mint coin before it’s official release date…which will go on sale at noon EST on the release date.

  70. says

    @ Sith….nice history lesson,, but today’s gold/silver ratio is based on the price ratio.

    Don’t get me wrong…I have always appreciated your comments and contributions to this blog, and consider you a friend.

    Let’s just as keep on stacking as we see fit.

    Have a great weekend Sith!, Steve

  71. Louis Golino, Author says

    When quoting others it is useful to note who said that and when they said it esp. where stats are used.

  72. a Bob says

    I would prefer to see the authors name on articles posted to MNB.
    Somehow I think I know Dan,Diana, Louis etc.
    Leave the aliases to the comments section.

  73. Sith says

    The pairing is deep rooted in monetary history. Croesus of Lydia is thought to be the first to have issued a bi-metallic currency. It had two silver coins – one at 10.7g and the other 5.35g. A gold coin was issued weighing 8.04g. With the gold-silver ratio kept at 13.3, 10 large silver coins were equal to one gold coin.

    This 13.3 gold-silver ratio was accepted by the Egyptians and the ratio traded at an average of 15 for the next few millennia. But it was not based on any highly complex fundamental analysis of the supply and demand of precious metals, but rather on the calculation that the silver moon moves 13.3 times faster across the heavens than the golden sun.

    Back in the Akkadian Empire, gold and silver were still used as a medium of exchange. But the prices of goods and services were based on the weight of metal, and typically denominated in a unit called a ‘shekel’, about 8.33 grams. The “shekel” was one of many standardized weights used to measure the value of monetary metals. The value of 1 shekel of silver was usually calculated as 1/15th of the value of 1 shekel of gold.

    In other words the gold / silver ratio was fixed. Its defenders say, the historic price levels of both metals, when silver was still part of the bimetallic monetary standard of its day was able to be maintained because the ratio was based on crude production estimates, IE they were extracting around 16 times more silver than gold, and as that corresponds with the estimate that there is 17.5 times more silver in the Earth’s crust than gold…

  74. cagcrisp says

    @Steve, “which will go on sale at noon EST on the release date.”

    Bullion coins are not sold directly to the public, so the AP’s don’t adhere to a noon release, just a date for Bullion coins…

  75. Sith says

    @Steve – You missed the point of my post, and the defense of the standard. I will re-post that sentence here.

    “The assumption is that silver will fulfill its traditional role as money, as such that ratio needs to come down to more historical levels.”

  76. says

    @Cagcrisp….I realize that….I sort of muddled bullion and numismatic release dates….sorry about that. But my point being, retailers can not ship you a Mint bullion or numismatic coin before either 1)bullion coins are sent to the AP’s for distribution, or 2)Numismatic coins have gone on sale at the Mint.

    Do you agree with this?

  77. Sith says

    @Steve – The reverse of that is, if you don’t think that silver or gold will ever be used as money again, then the ratio is bunk. I personally don’t know if we will ever go back to the gold standard much less a bimetallic standard, but hopefully we won’t, not because I believe that a gold standard is bad,or a barbarous relic, but because it would mean our current currency (Federal Reserve Notes) is worthless, and that is a lot of pain.

  78. So Krates says

    Steve/Sith – You are talking past each other. Yes, Steve, the ratio is calculated by using the price but Sith has very artfully described what some say the ratio should eventually revert to and why. In a perfect free market, assuming comparable ease of mining and refining, the natural occurrence of the physical metals in the Earth’s crust should express itself in direct proportion through the price. It is no accident that the ratio of pure gold in the $20 Saint-Gaudens to pure silver in the $1 Morgan is exactly……wait for it…………………………………………………

    16 to 1

  79. So Krates says

    That reported female to male ratio seems implausible. While it makes perfect sense the percentage of women ordering from the mint would be higher than typically observed on the bourse, it is incredible that it goes from less than 5% to over 50%. A simple survey of commenters here reveals only one regular female poster and one other infrequent lady contributor (plus Jeff’s fan-girl).

    I also wonder how many of those females’ accounts are set up by men skirting the HHLs. And as previously mentioned they are most likely purchasing lower cost items for gifts. If the numbers were broken out by money spent the ratio would most likely be drastically lower.

    If there were more women at the coin shows I might consider sporting a clean shirt 😉

  80. 1958 Chevrolet Bel Air says

    I wonder what decade or century we will return women to the observe of all of our coins?

  81. Zaz says

    @Sith & @ Mint News Blog…

    Sorry to keep on beating a dead horse, but that should be proof to you both that I am skipping pages of editorializing, many, many days worth as it is mostly Greek to me since I was not an Econ major in college. It’s really boring to read about arcane changes in the Fed over and over again, the pleasant hobby of numismatics here has been taken over by so much moralizing so that it resembles the homilies at mass. I’ve leave that for Sunday mornings, thank you very much. -ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZaz

  82. So Krates says

    Steve says, “…that historic gold/silver ratio of 16 to 1, is just that…old, old history and is no longer meaningful. If we had that ratio today, gold would only be $285”

    Or silver would be $80! Folks often forget that ratio reversions can go either way. People expect the price of platinum to increase in order for the imbalance to correct but the same reversion can be just as easily accomplished if the gold price drops enough.

    “…old, old history and is no longer meaningful.” Wow that statement brings back memories of the late 90’s “New Economy” when any internet related business was part of the “new paradigm” where PE ratios and dividends no longer mattered. Dot com busted. Nasdaq was closing in on 5000 in 1999. Still 5000 almost TWO DECADES later.

  83. So Krates says

    While it has been recognized for years that monetary policy does the heavy lifting there were in fact many attempts at stimulating the economy through fiscal policy.

    – Cash for Clunkers comes to mind.

    – There was a large first time home buyers program.

    – There was a direct payment sent out as a stimulus check to individual taxpayers

    – There were some tax code incentives. Increased deductions, accelerated depreciation, etc.

    – Large ($831,000,000,000) Stimulus package passed through congress with provisions for unemployment benefits, food stamps, housing subsidies, infrastucture, energy and education spending, etc.

    I was hoping for a massive 1930s style infrastucture spending program. We need a modern WPA or CCC. We need to rebuild our failing bridges and crappy roads while putting the slackers to work. The massive contributions of those programs from 75 years ago are still evident today all over the country. Time for a reboot!

  84. Sith says

    @Zaz – It seems strange that I agree with you, but you throw me under the bus, then back up over me…. 🙂 Sorry if I hurt your feelings, when I told you we actually already discussed something you claimed the blog did not think was important.

    @So Krates, Hear, hear! Now just imagine the comments if I discussed the historic Dow to gold ratio 🙂

    As far as women, “While the U.S. Mint’s overall customer base worldwide is overwhelmingly male, more than half of the Mint’s customers in the United States are female.” It would seem to me that a large percentage of mint customers reside overseas. That to me is more surprising than the large percentage of women customers.

  85. VA Bob says

    If 51% spend $20, while 10% spend $1000, how does that skew the customer numbers? We all know from our ladies here commenting on the site that the Mint has female customers, but as pointed out, how many are numismatic collectors and how many are buying for family or friends, and how much? How many are there to beat the HHL’s? A fair question to ask of men as well. I just believe it’s a little arbitrary to calculate who is who by who walks in the door. Maybe a deeper dive by the Mint’s survey team could break it down better. Personally, I really don’t care to give financial info out in any type of survey, especially another government entity. Others might as well.

    Direction of the Mint News Blog? I don’t get to read it for days on end now, let alone go through the hundreds of comments, a portion of which I’m sure are insightful. Like some others I used to check in religiously. Now, mainly to make sure I don’t miss a coin I’m interested in. Discussion about the coins themselves have shrunk long before any non-coin topic appeared. Since I don’t take financial advice from the blog, care what a coin is selling for on ebay, or what the price of a circus coin might be in 2050, there isn’t much for a person like me to discuss. Best of luck which ever way it goes. Catch you when I can.

  86. VA Bob says

    So Krates – Yeah, then just like the 30’s we’ll need a WWIII ( which probably won’t be as gentle as the last one) to get us out of the massive hole a WPA or CCC would bring. Almost 60% of our spending now is on social programs. Maybe we could get the people receiving a check now a work project job, many would look for work of their choice.

  87. Imwithher says

    Wow? I cant keep up with all this bantering , I came to the blog looking to learn about coins and the mint . All I see is who said what, maybe I need to search for another blog. I see these out of left field topics are only to generate more contributors and for the wrong reasons. Litmus test over please talk coins.

  88. says

    @So Krates….please excuse my ignorance, but how to you arrive a 16 to 1 gold/silver ratio between a Saint Gaudens gold, which contains .9675 oz of pure gold to a Morgan silver dollar which contains .77344 oz of pure silver. Please do the math for me. Thank you.

  89. says

    @Imwithher…your point is well taken….we should focus on coins….sorry to go off topic, but the gold/silver ratio does relate somewhat as to the bullion market….some people use “technical analysis” and some use “fundamental analyisis” ….or a combination of both to determine if at the present time, gold or silver bullion coins offer the most potential for appreciation.

    To be more clear, I’ll use stocks as an example….technical analysis could care less about what a company sells….they only look at price history…such as price levels of support (at the bottom range) and price levels of resistance (attached the bottom range). When prices break through these levels, lower or higher prices are expected until a new base line of support is established.

    Fundamental analysis, looks at PE ratios, EPS, revenue growth, etc to determine potential price values going up or down.

    Gold/Silver and other precious metals investors also use Technical analysis…..levels of support at the bottom and resistance at the top to see if prices break through these levels. Fundamental analysis of gold/silver looks more at supply/demand, and as Sith correctly referred to….mining production which correlates to supply.

    Cagcrisp, you are much more knowledgeable than I am in this, so please correct me if I am way off base or over simplified technical/fundamental analysis.

  90. says

    To get back on point, I look forward to a discussion of the upcoming gold WLH. How many do you plan to buy (if any) and what factors will determine your decision.

    I will post my thoughts on this coin when we get closer to release date and have a thread devoted to the coins release…..which will probably be a day before or the morning of release date….11/17/16

  91. So Krates says

    @ Steve – Making me do math on a Fri. night? I suppose I asked for it 🙂

    While I’m sure there is a more elegant way of expressing the relationship (Dave SW FL might be able to help here), I came to the 16:1 figure by converting each coin to dollars per one troy ounce of metal. Then after each coin is in dollar per oz. format, divide the gold price per oz. by the silver. price per oz.

    .St Gaudens – $20/.9675 toz. = $20.67/toz.

    Morgan – $1/.77344 toz. = $1.29/toz.

    $20.67/$1.29 = 16/1

  92. says

    @So Krates…very well done for so early in the morning.. Thanks

    So, I agree with others….we’ve beat this horse to death, and it’s time to move on to coin topics.

    I have a question to you guys/ladies….how many of you have purchased the Reagan C & C set are what are your positive/negative thoughts. I’ve read several comments saying they preferred a Silver medal instead of the Silver Eagle 30th Anniversary coin.

    I also wish the Mint would of done something special for the gold eagle 30th Anniversary….perhaps a enhanced unc…just something unique.

    And I agree with others….during this lull in releases, the Mint had/has an opportunity to do something special,….that would be nice.

    Have a great weekend everyone!

  93. Erik H says

    Wow I had a busy day yesterday and never had time to follow up on the comments I started. Sith & So Krates thanks for filling in.

    I’m surprised to learn about the 51% women ratio but I think the analysis provided is probably correct: to beat house hold limits, gift giving & small dollar amounts.

    That said, I personally have known more female collectors over the years than men (all middle aged too). A lot of the women I know told me they buy from govmint.com so they don’t seem to shop around (ironic, they don’t shop around).

    The last show I was at a woman walk in and asked the first dealer table for a graded 70 gold SLQ and bought it on the spot (once again no shopping the other tables) but she knew what she wanted (I didn’t pay attention to the price). So, it seems like women are out there collecting (probably in smaller amounts) but they are just quietly doing so.

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